New info on Dual Opteron SFF :)

[FastLaneJBUK]

Hi,

Just built my Zmaxdp and also had to change the fan position however it is spinning the fans up and down according to the temp.

Just wondering duc but what paste did you use? I've got the same CPU's as you but idling about 55C for CPU0, CPU1 is about 4 degrees lower like yours. It doesn't hence take much to push it up beyond 55 where the fans spin up. I did just use the paste that came with the machine but I'm wondering if I should use some Artic Silver or something?

Maybe you just have a cooler room than me of course but I'd like to get it as low as I can.

[duc]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
Just wondering duc but what paste did you use? I've got the same CPU's as you but idling about 55C for CPU0, CPU1 is about 4 degrees lower like yours. It doesn't hence take much to push it up beyond 55 where the fans spin up.

ShinEtsu paste, not too sure about the ambient temperature but those temps are what I have with Boinc running.

Another issue/problem thats popped-up is that my ZMAX won't restart. Whenever I exit the bios, restart from XP, Ctrl+Alt+Delete from dos prompt; it goes into standby and I have to hold the down power switch.

Have you tried the new bios? It won't take it, is it an AMI or Award bios?

[FastLaneJBUK]

Ah so your temps are at 48C or so under full load? Damn I must redo my pasting then.

I've also got 2x250 Opterons and live in the UK. XFX Geforce 6800GT, Maxtor 300GB (Company sent 1 wrong drive so only have one hooked up like you), NEC 3520A Writer and a Mitsumi Floppy/Card Reader though not hooked up the floppy yet as the only cable I have is about 400 metres long. Hehe.

Overall though, when the fans are spinned down it's extremely quiet and I'm really quite happy with it once I get the temps sorted anyways.

Oh and duc, no problems rebooting here. That's normally down to memory in my experience. I went for the Kingston RAM I mentioned in a post above. It's 2.5CAS DDR400 1GB sticks though right now I'm still at CAS 3.0. Would rather just get the temp sorted and make sure it's stable first before I lower the CAS though I've had a little game of HL2 DM and that was fine (I know, great use of a dual rig :P)

[FastLaneJBUK]

Well I've repasted it with Artic Silver 5 now and it's still about the same. Maybe a tad cooler but not much. My idle is around 55C with the fans spinning up and slowing down slightly. This is not doing anything on the PC really other than having it booted up and MBM running.

Do you use MBM or something else to check your temps duc?

I don't get it, I cannot see how there can be so much difference between our rigs when they have the same components. :( My case temp is reporting as 25C and my Geforce 6800GT in idle is 67C and it says the ambient temp is 52C.

House is heated to about 22C, maybe a bit hot but my misses is originally from India. Even then she's cold sometimes. Hehe.

Anyone any ideas?

Oh and switched to CAS 2.5, so far seems OK. Still no rebooting problems.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Repasted and tried everything but cannot change my temps. Also cannot flash the new BIOS either, says basically you need an Award BIOS on there in the first place and mine is AMI.

Might have to go with 2xFanMates, take the machine off controllable fans and put them on the full power headers but just slow them down a tad.

[duc]

I use the Winbond Hardware Doctor utility which comes on the driver cd to monitor temperatures. Adjusting the smartfan setting in Bios from 55 to 58 seems to get mine to run quieter with no increase in temp.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Ah well I'll have to try that tomorrow but I'm pretty sure the temps I see in MBM are what it's saying in the BIOS.

I'm curious though how setting the SmartFAN to 58 over 55 makes your machine quieter. Surely when even under full load your no where near 55 I'd have thought they'd stick at the slowest speed all the time. Weird.

I've e-mailed Iwill about it as I want to know what's going on with mine as yours is so much lower. I even swapped the CPU's around so the other one was doing all the memory work (No change) and tried them both on their own. On their own I can mirror your temps and the fans never spin up but with both of them in, it's a different story.

I think I will end up getting used to it but really my worry is more if something isn't right. It does seem to work just fine so far but it's niggling at me that something might be wrong.

Anyone else out here with dual Opteron 250's or even 248's? What idle temps are you getting?

If mine are too high would that suggest a faulty HSF? It cannot be my mounting as I've done it about 10 times already, always the same temps.

Would it be possible for one of the fans to be the wrong way around? I'm digging at straws here really.

Or maybe mine is quite normal and duc just has extremely good Opteron 250's that run much cooler. I think mine are week 40 it said in CPUID.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Temps are the same with HWDoctor. No change at all.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Right well I think my temps must be about right actually. In the Hexus review they mention this...

"With low-power Opterons, CPU temperature never rose over 48C under load, and with a BIOS SmartFan threshold of 58C, the fans never made more than a half-hearted whisper. The ZMAXdp, with those CPUs, is nearly silent."

That's with 244HE processors. I've got full blown 250's so the higher temp makes sense.

[duc]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
I'm curious though how setting the SmartFAN to 58 over 55 makes your machine quieter. Surely when even under full load your no where near 55 I'd have thought they'd stick at the slowest speed all the time. Weird.

With the smartfans at 55 I find that the fans spin up to max and down to minimum too frequently. At 58 the fans seem to only go upto 3000rpm before dropping slowly down, as the temp hasn't reached the next level for the fans to spin faster.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Ah so your machine is doing the same as mine. Most of the time mine won't reach full speed at 55C but they get close. Funnily and weirdly they spin up and down more and to a higher fan speed sitting in Windows doing nothing than say when I'm playing Half Life 2 Deathmatch which puts about 50% load on each CPU.

OK will try switching it to 58C and see what happens :)

I just thought my box wasn't working right but if yours is also spinning up and down then your temps cannot be that far off mine after all.

[Xspringe]

Does the zmaxdp support PowerNow (cool n quiet) for opterons?

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_543~92637,00.html

I imagine that this would be especially useful in such a cramped system as the zmaxdp.

[duc]

Originally posted by Xspringe
Does the zmaxdp support PowerNow (cool n quiet) for opterons?

http://www.amd.com/us-en/Corporate/VirtualPressRoom/0,,51_104_543~92637,00.html

I imagine that this would be especially useful in such a cramped system as the zmaxdp.

I think only on the up coming 90nm Opterons.

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by duc
I think only on the up coming 90nm Opterons.

Dammit, I really need to get one (or two ;) of those...

[[312]Seppuku]

has anyone considered modding one of these little bad boys with a zalman reserator 1? i remember reading about somone cooling two opterons and a video card off of one on the dk8n thread, might be spiffy ;)

[ironfistphil]

I love this so much, I bought the domain names.

zmaxdp.com
zmaxdp.net

[[312]Seppuku]

are you actually gonna post something usefull, or are you just gonna squat?

[SUOrangeman]

I saw this over in the Video Cad forum ...

MiniPCI TV tuner card (http://www.yuan.com.tw/en/products/vdo_mpc622.html)

I would definitely use this instead of the wireless card.

-SUO, still wants more SATA ports (well, at least one more!)

[[312]Seppuku]

that hardware encoder looks interesting, but how would you interface a video source with it? it looks like it's designed to be oem'd into notebooks which would then be hardwired at the manufacturers specifications

[kevikev]

Semi-waste of money IMO... most of the vendors link to their products off their main page, not their product-name.com.

Unless you're going to build an "I Love My ZMaxDP" site.

Originally posted by ironfistphil
I love this so much, I bought the domain names.

zmaxdp.com
zmaxdp.net

[ironfistphil]

Originally posted by kevikev
Semi-waste of money IMO... most of the vendors link to their products off their main page, not their product-name.com.

Unless you're going to build an "I Love My ZMaxDP" site.

Your right on both counts, it's your opinion and that's my exact plan.

[satori]

Originally posted by [312]Seppuku
that hardware encoder looks interesting, but how would you interface a video source with it? it looks like it's designed to be oem'd into notebooks which would then be hardwired at the manufacturers specifications

I believe JEC answered that for me in the vid forum. Apparantly there is a SMALL (teensie was the word he used) header in the corner for it. I would assume S-vid, Coax, and l/r audio, as the card specifies those as valid input. But if you plan to build your own Nano-itx 5" x 5" x 3" media box, it's a good thing, as you can run the ports anywhere your little heart (and dremel) dreams of. :)

[joho]

I have just received my shiny red box, and see that the manuals (v1.0) do not match the board (v1.0). The function of the open jumper blocks is not clear, and not explained. Even without needing them now, I would like to know what everything is. Can anyone point me to the function of these:

3 pin (CN12): looks like a fan header to me (and is one according to previous posts).
9 pin (CN14, CN4, J11, CN11): could be internal USB, or not...
8 pin (J7): could be USB as well, or an audio connection, or ...


And for those who want to know; Contrary to statements on the websites iwill.net and iwill-benelux.com (who state different things) the box only has one RJ45 jack for an ethernet connection, and the board does have an Marvel gigabit ethernet PHY. So it does seem to support gigabit ethernet. (Have no other device here to test against, ...and oh ehm no components in the box to make it run).

[jhaislet]

What ever you do, don't jumper anything.

You'll fry your board if you jump a fan header or a USB header, as they both supply current (12v & 5v).

[FastLaneJBUK]

Well the header right at the front of the mobo next to the front sound and firewire cables (I cannot remember the name of it) is 9 pin and is USB. I've got my internal card reader and internal bluetooth running off it.

As a side note, my rig has been running fine for a week odd now with no problems bar one which I have noticed...

The vbat is reporting 0.4 volts roughly and when I power down fully (PSU off or mains off) it's forgetting the CMOS settings within about 1 minute or so. No problems I thought, I put in another CMOS bat but it's still around 0.4-0.3 volts. Is this a faulty board is the extra few volts running my CPU's? :P

It's a minor problem but it's my last one and annoying me. Both bats are Panasonic +3V CR2032. I would test them on my multimeter but it's battery is flat but I think the one I replaced it with should have been full.

[kevikev]

Anyone thought of a good way to integrate water cooling for the zmaxdp so you can minimize the noise level?

Would converting the power supply to an external one improve things at all?

[JediFonger]

http://www.iwillstore.com/product.asp?pf_id=ZMAX%2DDP

look no further. it's already here.

[SUOrangeman]

How do Iwill Store prices generally compare to other vendors once products are readily available? For instance, Lynn Computer has been listing this thing for $786 for the last two months. The Iwill Store shows up with a $699 price. Once the ZMAXdp is widely available, should I expect vendors like NewEgg, Buy.com, etc. have it (much?) cheaper?

Honestly, all of this talk about dual-cores and the Professional 2xxx chipsets has made me less antsy. I sorta fear that a new and improved version will appear shortly after I've put the thing together.

-SUO, bleeding-edge wanna-be

[catscit]

Originally posted by SUOrangeman
Honestly, all of this talk about dual-cores and the Professional 2xxx chipsets has made me less antsy. I sorta fear that a new and improved version will appear shortly after I've put the thing together.


Welcome to reality. In this game of computers there is always something new and more exciting just a few months away. You can wait for new stuff ALWAYS...

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by catscit
Welcome to reality. In this game of computers there is always something new and more exciting just a few months away. You can wait for new stuff ALWAYS...

I completely agree. If you need an upgrade, just buy it.

And keep in mind that most release date rumors tend to be overly optimistic. E.g. a release date of 2nd quarter of the year tends to indicate that you won't see it available in normal quantities till december.

[SUOrangeman]

OK, I admit that my last line of comment was mostly in jest. The only thing really holding me back is the lack of more hands-on reports and **cost** implications of next month's release of the x52 Opterons (... and dual-core and Win64 shipments).

If I continue to wait much longer, it will not be because I anticipate something new in the pipeline.

-SUO

[mental]

Originally posted by SUOrangeman
next month's release of the x52 Opterons (... and dual-core)

-SUO
the dual-core Opterons are coming out next month? i thought they weren't going to be released until the 3rd quarter.

[SUOrangeman]

I've only heard that the x52 Opterons will be announced in February. A couple of folks are saying April for 64-bit Windows. Dual-cores are as good as anybody's guess. I'm just glad that Iwill changed the ZMAXdp's official page to claim support for dual-core CPUs.

Does the IwillStore actually have them in stock? Who's buying/bought stateside?

-SUO

[kevikev]

The ZmaxDP can use existing PC2100 ECC Registered RAM... so if you chose to re-use your existing Tiger MPX's RAM, how much of a performance drop would you encounter w/ your existing RAM rather than upgrading to the latest/greatest PC3200?

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by ironfistphil
Your right on both counts, it's your opinion and that's my exact plan.

Not a bad idea... at its height bp6.com was a great resource.

[einstein_pi]

BP6.com hah, even if it doesnt get much traffic its still a legend, and heck, I am still using my BP6 as my main comp. Only now am I planning an upgrade, I think it sadly has reached the end of the line for anything game related. Still not sure about the ZmaxDP, I think I can wait a while longer for some more feedback, and for lower processor prices.

[The Doctor]

Originally posted by einstein_pi
BP6.com hah, even if it doesnt get much traffic its still a legend, and heck, I am still using my BP6 as my main comp. Only now am I planning an upgrade, I think it sadly has reached the end of the line for anything game related. Still not sure about the ZmaxDP, I think I can wait a while longer for some more feedback, and for lower processor prices.

Oh yes... I love my BP6! It's in a cupboard somewhere at the moment, but I could never get rid of it... might use it for a Linux test machine, I think... :)

[Sesshoumaru]

Has anyone tried or will try the P3 SMP mod? I have them currently overclocked at 500mhz from 433. It's still tucked away in a box but I'm hoping to at least have it running at 1Ghz (x2) when I bring it out.

[einstein_pi]

Well, to answer your question - no, ive not used the P3 microcode, simply for the reason that, if I ever invested enough to buy 2x P3's, adaptors, etc, I would likely just buy a new comp.

You will likely find more answers already covered years ago on BP6.com btw.

On the ZmaxDP front.....damn, where are all of the reviews?

[B.Slisk]

Originally posted by B.Slisk
Question to all who have one of the production machines: Do the fan speed change when the machine get hot? The problem with overheating that I posted about earlier has now been solved. It was a rather uncommon problem, and it seems it only manifest with certain processors. However, after a lot of trial and error Titan came up with a solution. The new bios is available for download at Iwill Global website (http://www.iwill.net).

[kevikev]

Does this imply that fan noise is no longer a problem either?

Originally posted by B.Slisk
The problem with overheating that I posted about earlier has now been solved. It was a rather uncommon problem, and it seems it only manifest with certain processors. However, after a lot of trial and error Titan came up with a solution. The new bios is available for download at Iwill Global website (http://www.iwill.net).

[JediFonger]

ah yesh, i have one of those BP6s as well, although funnily enough, every other component in my BP6 is so godamn powerful that it makes me wanna upgrade to a dually opty. but i still luv BP6, i wanna *nix it. i dunno what to do.

http://www.fongunlimited.com/htpc/1200/

BACK to topic,

speaking of dually opty, has anyone purchased the opty SFF through iwill's site or anywhere on the internet? how is the FINAL retail version?

[B.Slisk]

Originally posted by kevikev
Does this imply that fan noise is no longer a problem either? The excessive fan noise that

[FastLaneJBUK]

Well I just put on the new BIOS and my ZmaxDP no longer works. It'll start booting Windows but before it even gets in, it just turns off. So I tried to install a new version of XP and it still just turns off.

It was working just fine before hand. The temps in the BIOS are being reported a lot lower than with the old BIOS and the fans are spinning fully down. They don't spin up in the time it's on (Only lasts about a minute tops) as I'm guessing it doesn't think it's getting hot enough however I think it's overheating.

Not too happy at all. I do already have an RMA on it because it doesn't remember it's CMOS settings when it's powered down and yes I've replaced the battery.

Maybe it's just faulty anyway but before the BIOS flash it at least worked 101% rock solid in Windows, now I cannot even get it to bootup.

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
Well I just put on the new BIOS and my ZmaxDP no longer works. It'll start booting Windows but before it even gets in, it just turns off. So I tried to install a new version of XP and it still just turns off.

It was working just fine before hand. The temps in the BIOS are being reported a lot lower than with the old BIOS and the fans are spinning fully down. They don't spin up in the time it's on (Only lasts about a minute tops) as I'm guessing it doesn't think it's getting hot enough however I think it's overheating.

Not too happy at all. I do already have an RMA on it because it doesn't remember it's CMOS settings when it's powered down and yes I've replaced the battery.

Maybe it's just faulty anyway but before the BIOS flash it at least worked 101% rock solid in Windows, now I cannot even get it to bootup.

Can't you flash it back to the old bios? You might succeed by entering the bios and underclocking your cpus, that way it won't get as hot and you might be able to boot into DOS to flash the old bios back.

[duc]

I know how Fastlane feels, I'm already having regrets about buying the ZMAX-dp. Even though its retail it still feels like a pre-production model.

The new bios supposedly updated the Opteron thermal curve for the smartfans which, in my case with 250s (OSA250CEP5AU), means the fans are stuck around the 3800rpm mark with no spin down which sounds annoying. There also seems to be an error in the temp reading; cpu0 constantly fluctuates from 47 to 51 then back to 47 with no readings inbetween. Swapping the 250s for 244s result in similar temps !?!?!

The lack of support and documentation coming from Iwill is the biggest disappointment. As I still to receive an email from them regarding my restart probelm. Ctrl-Alt-Delete or Windows restart will result in a POST reboot loop.

Originally posted by Xspringe
You might succeed by entering the bios and underclocking your cpus, that way it won't get as hot and you might be able to boot into DOS to flash the old bios back.

You can't underclock, the only options are for memory timings.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Well it didn't offer an option to backup the BIOS and the old BIOS isn't on the website so no. Also I think it highly risky to try and flash and a machine which just powers off at random.

I know how you feel duc. The new BIOS gives me CPU temp readings more in line with yours which you said initially for dual Opteron 250's. I set the Smartfan down to 40 C and even then it only spins up a bit when say I try a game which maxes 1 CPU. However it is just plain cutting out. No warning, bang. No power. I feel like the PSU might be overheating as the fans aren't spinning anywhere near the speed they were when it thought my Opterons were running a lot hotter. What else could cause it to cut out like that?

I've never had your reboot problem though Duc. Mine has always restarted with no problems.

I did e-mail Iwill a long time ago and no responce at all. Not impressed. I kind of regret getting the Zmax-DP too. I love the concept, the size and such but it just doesn't seem to be working out. However I feel like I might be stuck with it.

Oh and Duc, I take it you now have your 2nd Maxtor HDD connected? I've got mine connected but it was running OK with them.

One last thing, I think my graphics card gets too hot in the case. I think the model you picked Duc has a copper cooler, I wish I'd gone for one of them over the one I have as I've started to get lines most of the time. I guess it needs to go back too. :( :( :(

[JediFonger]

this is where the axiom of early adopters beware applies. i'm glad you're all working it out for me before i buy one... 3 years later =).

[FastLaneJBUK]

It's occured to me that the BIOS flash might not have had anything to do with my shutdown problems. Maybe the PSU was on the way out all along which might explain the lines that were slowly getting worse on my Graphics Card. Maybe it wasn't getting all the juice it needed.

So maybe it was just a coincidence that it happened around that time, maybe not.

I fix computers at work, I hate having to mess around with my own when I get home. I just want it to work.

Zmax is packed and off on an RMA tomorrow. Hopefully a new one will be better.

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
It's occured to me that the BIOS flash might not have had anything to do with my shutdown problems. Maybe the PSU was on the way out all along which might explain the lines that were slowly getting worse on my Graphics Card. Maybe it wasn't getting all the juice it needed.

So maybe it was just a coincidence that it happened around that time, maybe not.

I fix computers at work, I hate having to mess around with my own when I get home. I just want it to work.

Zmax is packed and off on an RMA tomorrow. Hopefully a new one will be better.

Good luck! Please keep us up to date.

[SUOrangeman]

First sign of x52 Opterons? (http://www.techonweb.com/products/prodsearch.aspx?cid=B1A1A0AE) (may have to sort or go to follow-on pages to actually see the 852 and 252)

As has been expected, the x52 prices are set at x50 levels. The pattern will trickle down, putting the x48s below the $500 sweet spot. This should make the ZMAXdp a little more palitable, especially if 90nm Opteron 248s are now the norm.

I've just got to remember to stay away from that nasty BIOS update.

-SUO

[hubgods]

First time poster....just wanted to share my ZMAXdp build experience since it was so positive. I ordered my system directly from the IWILL store and it shipped the next business day (good start). System was double boxed and was totally unblemished when I opened it.

After reading all of the posts re: fan noise, I specifically went with low power Opteron 246 HE CPUs for the system. Installing them along with (2) 300GB Maxtor SATA drives, Pioneer 16x DVD Burner, a Geforce 6800 card and a couple of 512MB Samsung PC3200 sticks was very straightforward and took me about 45 minutes to complete. One annoyance: it mentions the swing-out drive cage, but I have yet to make mine work like that at all.

I'm getting IDLE temps in the ~ 25C range per CPU and under load in the upper 30's. The system is actually VERY quiet and is a big improvement over the Sun Opteron Workstation it is replacing.

I am very impressed with the fit & finish of the ZMAXdp as well - no sharp edges, terrific paint job (I have the Black finish) and everything works as advertised. I would have no reservations recommending to anyone considering it. Cheers....

[SUOrangeman]

Sounds great, hub. I really want to go with a pair of 248s @ 90nm ... and am willing to wait, if I must.

Did IwillStore give you any options (like the color or WiFi)? No options seem to evident just looking at the pages and adding the ZMAXdp to your cart.

Other than selling Iwill products, is IwillStore directly connected with Iwill (the manufacturer)?

-SUO

[daytrade]

Originally posted by SUOrangeman

Did IwillStore give you any options (like the color or WiFi)? No options seem to evident just looking at the pages and adding the ZMAXdp to your cart.



-SUO


I emailed the Iwill store last week about color options (was curious if they had a red or white one) but never heard back from them. :(

[hubgods]

I was not given any choices other than shipping method (which was WAY overpriced at $70 for 2-day service). I lucked out in that I wanted the Black version and that is all they seemed to offer at the store - at least that I could see.

Mine came with the Wireless card installed and while the fin does not seem to fit too tightly, it's wireless performance is very good. (I'm comparing against USB and PC Card alternatives I use regularly in my house).

By the way, in checking with the HW Doctor tool that came with the unit, my fan speed has yet to cross the 2000 rpm mark and is very quiet IMHO - especially since it is a 2-way system. It is only slightly more noticeable than an Antec Sonata system with 1 120mm fan that I built for my wife.

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by hubgods
I was not given any choices other than shipping method (which was WAY overpriced at $70 for 2-day service). I lucked out in that I wanted the Black version and that is all they seemed to offer at the store - at least that I could see.

Mine came with the Wireless card installed and while the fin does not seem to fit too tightly, it's wireless performance is very good. (I'm comparing against USB and PC Card alternatives I use regularly in my house).

By the way, in checking with the HW Doctor tool that came with the unit, my fan speed has yet to cross the 2000 rpm mark and is very quiet IMHO - especially since it is a 2-way system. It is only slightly more noticeable than an Antec Sonata system with 1 120mm fan that I built for my wife.

This is very encouraging information. I wonder how noise levels be with 90 nm opterons with powernow! enabled. If only AMD would hurry up with making these available :(

[iatacs19]

If it's not too much to ask, can you guys post how much you paid for the the CPUs?

[Xspringe]

The ZmaxDP is now on newegg. With quite a hefty pricetag if I may add.

http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?DEPA=0&description=56-101-809&CMP=OTC-pr1c3watch&ATT=Workstations

[einstein_pi]

A $679 pricetag is the cheapest that I've seen online so far.

Of course, I wish it would've been more in line with the original price quotes of $400-500ish that we were given at its intro.

[jsnorman]

Just ordered mine from iwill on sale for 699 (missed the link to Newegg, where I could have saved $20, oh well).

Going to try it with opteron 240's since these are usually overclockable?

I also ordered the Corsair TWINX-3200RE-C2 modules (1gb total), and will be using plain old fashioned IDE drives.

I will be running Suse 9.2 64 bit

I will update when I have it all working.

[hubgods]

I bought my two low power Opterons as part of a larger lot from a business partner, but I see that they go for about $700/ea on Pricewatch and I paid much less than that.

With only $5 for FEDEX shipping, I would have saved more like $90 from Newegg. :(

Maybe I'll buy another one from them and use some low power 846's that I have in it and then sell it on Ebay. :)

[duc]

Originally posted by jsnorman
Going to try it with opteron 240's since these are usually overclockable?

I also ordered the Corsair TWINX-3200RE-C2 modules (1gb total), and will be using plain old fashioned IDE drives.

Unfortunately there are absolutely no overclocking options at all, nvidia's ntune/system utility has no options either.

You may want to check the core revisions for those 240s, make sure that they are at least C0s otherwise the Corsair memory may drop to PC2700 instead.

Originally posted by hubgods
Maybe I'll buy another one from them and use some low power 846's that I have in it and then sell it on Ebay. :)

I'd be more interested in the getting hold of low power CPUs, ZMAX I got just can't find any HE Opterons in UK.

[Sesshoumaru]

What about the Clockgen program from cpuid.com?

[duc]

Originally posted by Sesshoumaru
What about the Clockgen program from cpuid.com?

Opteron 244 1.8GHz (200 x 9)

Ran Clockgen briefly, adjusted HTT to 211.91 to give an extra 100MHz. CPU-Z reports 1.9GHz and for a moment I though this might be interesting. However, on running SiSoft's CPU Arithmetric Benchmark, the results from before and after are negligible. SiSoft doesn't show an increase in speed, the same when running Memory Bandwidth benchmark.

Ran Central Brain Indentifier and HTT remains at 200.:(

[iatacs19]

I am almost ready to pull the trigger and get the whole setup from newegg.com, but have 1 question left:

When I buy the Opteron CPUs do I need to look out for something?

I have always bought intel cpu + intel chipset and I know that with intel the retail CPUs are a little better and that you should always try to match the steppings if possible when running dual configuration. Is it the same with AMD? Also, I know that VIA chipsets are not as solid as intel, are Nvidia chipsets solid? and do they have good support in windowsXP or do you have to keep downloading those 3-in-1 drivers?

[M0biUS]

I have a question for the guy's that have there zmax dp at home... Can you change the multiplier on the processors? I saw a swedish guy that had a dual opteron with a iwill motherboard dont know witch but he could change the multi so his 248 became 250 without putting any more vcore.

Becuse on the web I seen lots of people trying to clock there opterons and get 200mhz with compressor cooling becuse they have to give much much more vcore to higher fsb.

So it would be fun to know if iwill has put the same feture in the zmax dp!?

[FastLaneJBUK]

No, unfortantely as Duc said. There are no overclocking options at all.

I was also going to get some HE's but like Duc, I couldn't find any in the UK anywhere. Hopefully when I get my next ZmaxDP back I'll have more luck with it.

If not then I'll have to consider a full tower option which would be a shame as I like the form and style of the ZmaxDP.

[SUOrangeman]

Updating my original price quote (http://forums.2cpu.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=496493#post496493),

I'm still considering:

NewEgg Wishlist ..........$4235 (http://newegg.com/app/wishr.asp?id=1310375):
Iwill zMAXdp Chassis
AMD Opteron 248 (x2) ... had 250s in original post
1GB PC3200 Registered DIMM (x2)
Western Digital 74GB Raptor SATA Hard Drive
Seagate ST3400832AS SATA Hard Drive (x2)
Seagate ST3400832A IDE Hard Drive
ValueDisk 3.5" SATA Hard Drive External Enclosure
nVidia GeForce 6x00 Dual-DVI AGP Video Card

Plus:
ValueDisk Triple-Interface 3.5" IDE Hard Drive External Enclosure....$59 (http://www.memorylabs.net/vaextrcoexha.html)
Creative Megaworks 650 6.1 THZ Speaker Set ... $200 eBay (had Klipsch 5.1 in original post)

So, I have about $4500+S/H yet to purchase. I'll likely dump the video card for a 6600-based card (BFG?), shaving $300 or so off the total.

With the Opteron x52 all but official, expect the 248s to drop a good $200 each. Monarch just dropped them to $450 (http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=120437&AFFIL=dt&NR=1)

-SUO

[jsnorman]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
No, unfortantely as Duc said. There are no overclocking options at all.

I was also going to get some HE's but like Duc, I couldn't find any in the UK anywhere. Hopefully when I get my next ZmaxDP back I'll have more luck with it.
.

That is really disappointing. I had read that shipping versions of this would include some overclocking options. I wonder whether it just has not made it into BIOS revisions yet? Has anyone (successfully) installed the 1.07 BIOS that is up on iwill's support page?

The nforce chipset, as well as other iwill boards, are typically decent at overclocking capabilities. Oh well, I was wanting to get the dual core cpus when they ever come out so I guess without overclockng to play with, that is what I will do with this.

[hubgods]

I did not think that the HE parts were that scarce (costly, yes), but I guess that most places would treat them as special order rather than carrying in inventory.

One other install note: I had some network issus in terms of the link dropping in and out on the Gig-E port that were addressed by upgrading the standard driver from 3/24/04 to the current WHQL one from later last year (4.4.2 from the 5.1 nForce driver set).

Will consider trades for 2 x 846 HE CPUs...for the right terms of course. :)

[FastLaneJBUK]

Well before I had to RMA my ZmaxDP I had the 1.07 BIOS on and it doesn't have overclocking options. It's this BIOS that started my otherwise perfectly stable Zmax to turn off after random periods of short time.

Maybe it was a PSU fault that just happened around the same time, I don't know but it was fine before I put on 1.07. Duc is having problems with the 1.07 as well but different to what I had.

Duc, are you still running slower Opterons or gone back to the 250's?

[duc]

I'm using the 244s for now (45c and 2300rpm) , bios 0107 and 250s is too much of a headache.

[FastLaneJBUK]

That's a shame Duc, I'm pretty sure I won't be trying the new BIOS when I get my replacement unless there is a way I can backup the original to go back if needs be.

Even though mine was cutting out, my fan noise was much quieter with the 1.07 BIOS. I think about 2500rpm or so if I remember right but it wasn't spinning up and down like it was with the previous BIOS.

[kevikev]

Are the HEs not really necessary for a reasonably quiet system or do they result in an even lower fan speed than the 2300-2500s?

[duc]

Looking inside the PSU, Iwill has used some cheap (IMHO) ADDA fans. The fan ref is AD0712UB-A79GP, which looking at the ADDA fan chart shows these to be ultra-high speed ball-bearing fans. About 37.8dBs, so you can just imagine the noise when two of these are encased inside a PSU running full pelt.

I might RMA mine first to sort out the restart problem before attempting to change the fans.

[hubgods]

I don't think that HE variant processors are the only realistic option for the ZMAXdp, but if you value a quiet workspace I would HIGHLY recommend them. It all comes down to personal priorities and the price/performance you assign to them.

I just place a high value on quiet speed is all..... :)

[SUOrangeman]

In case it hasn't been brought to our attention directly, ...

Get your 90nm Opterons (http://www2.amd.com/us-en/protected/Weblets/1,,7832_11341,00.html?redir=CPQR09) here. Well, at least you can find out which OPNs (242 through 252, but only 146 in the 1xx line) and steppings (D4 or E4) to get.

Is there a US vendor that will guarantee a chip's stepping?

-SUO

[jsnorman]

UPDATE

Burn in test worked fine. I compiled Gentoo amd64 over the weekend, and emerged the whole system from a stage 1 tarball - despite the apparant flaky bios temps, the cpu's are still humming away and the fans stayed whisper quiet the whole time.

I did dump suse 9.2 64 bit edition. It was just too flaky. I figured if I am going to have to deal with fixing everything I might as well rebuild the whole system using gentoo, which is what I just finished doing.

The extra USB ports are really great - I highly recommend getting a combo floppy/card reader drive for the 3.5" slot (mitsumi makes black ones). The usb cable plugs right into the mb so you can still keep all 8 ports free.

Also, running the Corsair Twinx (the ones made for Athlon fx "only") at cl 2.5 ddr 400 and so far, so good. I will try tweaking some of the othe rmemory settings sometime this week.

END UPDATE

I received mine Thursday, and finished building/installing today. Installed SuSE 9.2 (download edition), and updated that to SuSE 9.2 64 bit edition using yast.

CPUs are 2x 240 (each $188 at NewEgg)
Corsair TwinX 1GB dual channel DDR 400 (made for Athlon FX works fine)
160GB SATA maxtor ultra internal
3.5" floppy/card reader 7-1 combo drive
LG 4163B DVD writer
Radeon 9550 AGP 8x graphics

Note that I spent only about $550 more on this setup, versus the Shuttle cube Athlon 64 I was going to build using an athlon 64 3500, due to the low prices of the low end opterons now.

Anyway, I plan to upgrade to the dual cores someday, but these will do for now.

A couple of surprises based on previous reviews/posts: (a) my zmaxdp did include the wireless 802.11x minipci card - I have not tried it yet since but it included a manual too, and (b) there is at least one unused (and I am pretty sure a second) live USB 2.0 header (2 ports per header) on the motherboard - I connected a card reader in the 3.5" external bay, and hooked up the usb connector to this header and it works fine. The USB header is located near the front of the board, and has the typical USB header pins (1 row of 4, 1 row of 5 - each row a seperate port, with the 5th pin and missing 5th pin a dummy to indicate orientation of the ports).

The hardware install was very easy. I used the Artic Silver paste spread very thin. The only difficult part was mounting the heat pipes. That required a very long screwdriver I did not have. Also, the copper bottoms have plastic on them make sure you remove the plastic - I did not the first time and had to start over when I noticed. Finally, it does take some moving around to get the heat sinks totally flat before tightening the screws, but overall this was not too hard.

I installed SuSE 9.2 64 bit edition. Install went very smoothly, except the network driver. SuSE could not identify the network card, and the nvidia chipset drivers that are on iWill's website are in source code, not exactly plug and play! The standard NE2000 driver worked fine, although that will not deliver gb ethernet performance. I will try compiling in the nvidia drivers next week.

Temperature monitoring is way out of wack as noted on some earlier posts - my CPU temps are reading 14 degrees celsius which is below room temp, obviously wrong. I am not sure whether this is affecting the fans, but they are now whisper quiet. I hope they are not quiet merely because the temp readings in the BIOS are wrong!!!!! We will see this weekend as I am running burn in all weekend which will clearly overheat the CPUs if the fans do not kick in, but so far it has been running 4 hours straight without any problem.

A signal that iWill reads reviews - the last review noted that screws were not included for mounting drives. IWill included a package of screws in my box (good!) but unfortunately, they were the larger screws used to hold PCI cards in place, and not the smaller M3 needed for mounting drives! Also, for the price range of this box, I really would have liked to see screwless rails.

You need a floppy cable - about the only cable NOT provided by IWill.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Yes I think the incorrect temp readings was the problem I was having with my ZmaxDP and my Opteron 250's. I think it was getting too hot and cutting the whole system out.

[ivo]

i got my zmaxdp yesterday and i did build it right after. unfortunately it is not booting. nothing on screen. think there is a bios problem, since it does not even recognize the keyboard. anyone ever heared about this problem?

2 x 246 CPU's
2 x 1024 kingstone 3200 reg ecc RAM
asus 9600 xt GPU
200gb seagate baracuda SATA-HD

[Xspringe]

Originally posted by ivo
i got my zmaxdp yesterday and i did build it right after. unfortunately it is not booting. nothing on screen. think there is a bios problem, since it does not even recognize the keyboard. anyone ever heared about this problem?

2 x 246 CPU's
2 x 1024 kingstone 3200 reg ecc RAM
asus 9600 xt GPU
200gb seagate baracuda SATA-HD

:(

Could you tell me which stepping of opteron 246's you received?

[ivo]

thank you for your answer

in fact, to be more percise, i got two zmaxdp's. in one i did put two 244 1,8ghz cpu's and in the other i did put two 246 2ghz cpu's. both do not boot. they are having the same problem, i guess. i'm not quite sure wether this answers your question (stepping). sorry but my motherlanguage is not english.

[ivo]

again...

sorry Xspringe but i definitively do not know what stepping i have got. there is nothing written on the ordersheet and i do not have the boxes here right now. but in which way the stepping influences the zmaxdp, since iwill itself does not inform about restrictions on different steppings (as far as i did see on the offical website)?

[iatacs19]

If you can look at the CPU itself then you can find what stepping you have.

Here is a good thread to the AMD spec sheet:

Scroll a little then click on the hyperlink (http://forums.amd.com/index.php?showtopic=38931)


Example (for an Opteron 244):
OSA244CCO5AH -> rev. B3
OSA244CEP5AL -> rev. C0
OSA244CEP5AU -> rev. CG

[ivo]

well, i did read a bit of this document. interesting, but in which way does this affect the zmaxdp. in the worst case, it seems the my ram would run at DDR333-speed if i underdstood correctly. or, are there any inconpatibilties with the mobo of the zmaxdp?

sorry for these newbie questions. i am just a bit frustrated cause the barebones don't work..

[duc]

It could be one of two things. I've read on other boards that the nforce3 chipset has compatibility issues with some ATi 9600 graphics cards, it could be that. Secondly, it could be the memory, the ZMAX-DP will run the memory using the SPD values and will not down-clock. Thus, if your Opterons are of the older cores it may not be compatible with your chosen ram.

[ivo]

Originally posted by duc
It could be one of two things. I've read on other boards that the nforce3 chipset has compatibility issues with some ATi 9600 graphics cards, it could be that. Secondly, it could be the memory, the ZMAX-DP will run the memory using the SPD values and will not down-clock. Thus, if your Opterons are of the older cores it may not be compatible with your chosen ram.

ok, ok. i mean even if i'd remove everything the bios should boot shouldn't it?

so i tried to boot without the ram -> nothing
i tried a his 9700pro -> nothing
i tried a matrox 550 -> nothing

i did not try to boot it without the opterons becaus i do not have a second termal-paste. anyway, if it was compatibility problem the mobo would beep. it does not...

[iatacs19]

look for the jumper to clear the CMOS, might also try to take out the battery for a few minutes then put it back.

I forget if you need RAM to POST or not...

It would be ideal to check and make sure the CPUs are seated properly, etc.

Try to boot with the least amount of things plugged in and if it works start adding 1 peripheral at a time until you get more errors.

[ivo]

i allready cleared the cmos before. also the batery was removed and checked (2.99v).

once again: does anyone ever had similar problems?


btw: what does 'I forget if you need RAM to POST or not..' mean... ...my english.

[jsnorman]

ivo -

To answer your question, no I have not heard of anyone having similar problems. I do not think this is a problem with the zmaxdp either.

POST means "Power On Self Test". It is the very first thing that your computer will do. It is a BIOS function, that checks memory, CPU, Video, Keyboard, IDE/SATA to make sure nothing critical is missing/wrong. If you cannot POST, it almost always means you installed something wrong, or have a bad CPU.

POST problems are identified with beeps. Different beeps signal different problems. You have said you are getting nothing, no beeps. That means no POST is happening, which means something is really wrong.

There are generally only four reasons why you generally would get no POST: (1) corrupted BIOS, (2) no CPU or incorrectly seated CPU, (3) power problems, or (4) no memory (I am not sure about this last one - some motherboards will give you a POST beep even with no memory, others will not POST at all). You do not get POST in these situations because POST cannot run without a CPU, or if the POST BIOS code is corrupted. Even with incompatible memory, incompatible video. etc. you usually get POST beeps as you indicated. It is POSSIBLE that a compatibility issue - especially one involving your CPU/memory combination could prevent a POST, but again that is very rare.

You said that you are having this problem in TWO different machines? Same problem? If so, I would think it is HIGHLY unlikely that the BIOS would be corrupted in TWO machines. You have swapped the video cards, so that cannot be it. I would try some different memory (try using only 1 stick of good quality Corsair memory like the TwinX).

BIOS corruption is rare, I have never experienced it in 10 years of building my PCs.

So that leads me to your Power or CPU.

Doubel check the power connection to the motherboard. I assume you have the power swith turned ON and not OFF on the back of the machine, and that your wall outlet is delivering good AC voltage (yes, I know a stupid question, but little things like that have stumped me before so it never hurts to check).

As far as the CPUs, you have 4 CPUs, all apparantly with the same problem.. Either you are buying dead CPUs from someone, or you are doing something that is killing your CPUs, or (most likely) you are not seating the CPUs correctly. I would double check the golden triangles on all CPUs. Make sure when you seat the CPUs that the level is pulled ALL THE WAY up, and then locked down. Again, these are simple things but do not overlook the simple things before moving on to the less likely things.

[ivo]

jsnorman

Thank you a lot for your serious answer. I see, I will have to percise my situation. First, I will have to give you the complete configuration of the two iwill barebones. One of it is red the other black.

red:

2 x 244 Opterons CPU
2 x 1024 Kingston 3200 reg ECC KVR400X72RC3A/1G
200GB SATA seagate Barracuda HD
9700pro HIS GPU
noname CD-DVD rw IDE


black:

2 x 246 Opterons CPU
2 x 1024 Kingston 3200 reg ECC KVR400X72RC3A/1G
200GB SATA seagate Barracuda HD
9600XT/TD asus GPU
Samsung CD-DVD rw IDE

I hope this will help for further posts. Unfortunately I did not watch out for the CPU's ids before I built them in. So, I can not tell you the stepping yet.

Memory problems - The red one could have problems because of the Memory. As i did read <a href="http://forums.amd.com/index.php?showtopic=38931" target="_blank">here</a>, the first stepping of the 244 otperon does not support pc-3200 RAM. Unfortunately, I do not have other Memory right now to test it. Furthermore. I think that Kingston produces 'good quality' memory. Actually, I wanted to buy the TwinX but because of lack in avayability I finally took the Kingston RAM. To be checked out.

CPU problems - The CPU's are bradnew. I bought them boxed in mid january in Switzerland. The vendor is a quite established shop in the town I come from. I can not really imagine that he sold me crap. Anyway, I will have to dissassemble the cooling system and check the CPU's but not before monday untill I got a new set of termal-past. This would be the occasion to check also the id and the stepping of the CPU's.

'simple things' problems - O yes, this is so true, man. But this time it doe not look to be so easy. Everything checked. The PSU is suplying all the patrs with energy since HD's, Fans, and LED's are working. The barebones even make this fancy airplane-sound while powering on. Though I did not check all the voltages of the different supplies by the voltmeter yet.

Allover it seems that I have a serious problem that is not solved yet. The strange thing is that the two of them behave the same way. So, thanks again for all the post and hints that may help...

regard...

...ivo

[zilch]

ivo,

I'm suffering the exact same problem here. Didn't hear about the different cpu steppings supporting only DDR 333 vs 400 until picking up on this thread just now. Bummer. When I ordered my zmaxdp, I had a stick of 512MB PC3200 DDR 400 unregistered RAM and thought I would wait to see if this non-ecc unregistered sticks would work. Since I ran into the same situation as you had described (no POST codes, no video, fan only spins up, front USB ports lit up), I assumed it had to do with the unregistered RAM and decided to order the registered RAM. It should be arriving Monday or Tuesday. However, when I ordered the registered RAM, I didn't hear about the need to distinguish between needing DDR 333 or 400, so I made the mistake of ordering the DDR 400. I'm unsure what stepping my dual opteron 242 are. Like you, I had applied the arctic silver compound and would rather not waste what little I have left until I run out of options to try.

For kicks, I did try 3 different video cards with the same result (ATI AIW 8500DV, GeForce MX PCI, ATI AIW 9600).

Here's my specs
2 x 242 Opteron
1 x 512MB Corsair PC3200 DDR400 unregistered
80GB Seagate SATA
ATI AIW 9600
IOMagic 16X DL DVD+/-RW

I'll post my results when the new registered stick arrives. Sure wish I had known this before ordering. Just hope my cpu stepping allows for the DDR400.

zilch

[iatacs19]

As long as you have stepping AL or AU you should be able to run DDR400.

oh, btw I believe you have to run the memory in pairs.

[duc]

I purchased my Opterons OEM, just wondering does the Retail ones have the OPN printed on the box? If so you could check the core revision from that.

[ivo]

zilch -

Shit! I am quite glad to know to be not the only one having this problem. (To be sure: I am not glad that you have problems rather than I met you). I informed the IWILL-suport about this problem. I think you should do the same. On the official IWILL-site I first didn't find any place to ask for suport. Then I looked on their site in the US and I found a adress to mail to. They say to answer within five days but I didn't get the answer yet.

The specifications in the doc that's given from IWILL are not so clear about the RAM. First, it's just written that you should use reg. DDR DIMMs and they recomend to take DIMMs of the same vendor and the same CAS latency - what I did. They also recomend to use both slots for better performance. Then they say that you could use also DDR-SDRAM - what suprised me. How do they make the Opterons work with that? Then they say: 'For a complete list of specifications, see detail specification.' Ok, if they just would indicate where to find it.

Btw Zilch, can you tell me where you did order the barebone?

diggin' further

ivo

[ivo]

Originally posted by iatacs19
If you can look at the CPU itself then you can find what stepping you have.

Here is a good thread to the AMD spec sheet:

Scroll a little then click on the hyperlink (http://forums.amd.com/index.php?showtopic=38931)

I checked the stepping of the two 244s. Both ONP end with AU which means that their stepping is GC. Tried to boot with each of the procs one at a time ->nothing.

GC-stepping should be fine for my memory. So, I made a memorycheck on an other mobo. All the sticks are ok.

One thing my attention was put by a suporter is about the LEDs. He told me that the FrontLEDs which illuminate the USB-pots schould turn red as soon as a device is plugged. This should function independently on the mobo resp. the BIOS. For both of my ZmaxDPs, they do not change colors.

[hubgods]

I too had the same initial no-boot issue, first due to trying to run mixed brand pair of dimms, but then after I got it working with a matched pair, it happened again. I finally was able to root cause it down to a short on the mainboard that I was causing by my installation of the dual heatsink mechanism. After making some manual adjustments with screw torque and ensuring a PERFECTLY LEVEL install, the problem was resolved.

Just one other item to consider....

(P.S. I could not get a Buffalo 512MB PC3200 DIMM I purchased new to work in my ZMAXdp, but my Micron 512MB modules work great)

[FastLaneJBUK]

While I still don't have mine back. I remember that the USB ports change colour once the BIOS code has run through for the USB ports. Until then the device isn't detected and they won't change colour.

[duc]

Here's a tip to ensure proper heatsink installation:

The PSU is held to the rear of the ZMAX-DP by 2 brackets and 8 screws. Remove the 4 screws holding the brackets (2 screws top and 2 bottom) to the ZMAX. After this is done you can ease the PSU back approx. 1.5cm giving you more room to install the heatsinks. It looks like it was designed to allow this as the PSU has a kink at the bottom to allow this much maneuvering.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Exactly the same way I did it Duc. So much easier.

[kevikev]

Any firsthand experiences using a pair of 1GB sticks yet?

[FastLaneJBUK]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure duc had 2 x 1GB sticks and I also had 2 x 1GB sticks.

I used Kingston sticks which some other people on here who are having problems with lower end Opterons are using but I had no problems with my 2 x 250's

Maybe before 2006 I'll have my RMA completed and a Zmax returned back to me.

[duc]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
Yeah, I'm pretty sure duc had 2 x 1GB sticks and I also had 2 x 1GB sticks.

I used Kingston sticks which some other people on here who are having problems with lower end Opterons are using but I had no problems with my 2 x 250's

I had 2x ATP 1GB sticks that was compatibile with my previous Tiger K8W but not with the ZMAX-DP. They were the stacked TSOP variety and would randomly crash with the ZMAX. Exchanged those for a pair of Micron Crucial 1GB BGA sticks and everything is fine.

[ivo]

Still not found the cause of the problems I have a RAM question.
Does anyone have experience with 2 x 1gb Kingston 3200 reg ECC KVR400X72RC3A/1G in the ZMaxDp? Even if the stick itself is not listed in the compatibility lits of Iwill the same chipset is shown (Samsung K4H510838B-TCCC) what leads me to another question: If the chipset on the RAM is the same, which is the difference between the sticks of different vendors?

duc, what does TSOP variety mean?

regards...

...ivo

[iatacs19]

I think it's safe to say that as long as the chips are the same the ram module will be compatible. (chips = actual ram chips, module = PCB + ram chips)

the difference in the modules, between vendors can be all sorts of things, obviously the PCB can be different, but some vendors also bin their chips, picking the best ones for higher speeds, ex. PC3500 and stuff like that. I would say that as long as you are buying from a known vendor like crucial, mushkin, corsair or kingston you should be getting good quality modules.

TSOP is just the standard packaging for ram chips. The one that is rectangular and flat with the connections coming out of the sides.
BGA is a newer packing with little balls on one side of the face so when you look at it, it doesn't have the connections coming out of the sides since they are underneath. and the shape is more square, but that's not so important.

[ivo]

iatacs19

thak you for your prompt answer. think, i will have to look up some abreviations. still learning.

...ivo

[zilch]

ivo,
I just sent you a pm on my progress. To recap for anyone else that might be lurking for a clue or an answer. My problem with the zmaxdp inability to boot was corrected with 2 sticks of DDR400 PC3200 registered RAM that I picked up from here (http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproductdesc.asp?description=20-208-122&DEPA=1) . At first I bought one stick and no boot. So I bit the bullet and ordered a 2nd stick like iatacs19 mentioned. When I plugged the 2nd stick in, again no boot. Then I realized I had left the Clear CMOS jumper in the enable state. As soon as I jumpered it back to the Normal state...Voila! The sweet sound of zmaxdp's fan incrementally spinning down and an error asking for a bootable drive, since I had the bare minimum plugged in. Since Thursday, I've loaded Win2003 server and WinXP as a test and so far so good. I'm a bit worried about the temp though.

BTW, I did try using just one 242 with one stick of the registered RAM and the system didn't boot, but I think I might also have left the Clear CMOS jumper in the enabled state before the 2nd stick of RAM arrived.

Thanks all for your advice and assistance. ivo, I know it's frustrating when the sucker doesn't boot, just hang in there and wish you best of luck in taming your zmaxdp beast.

zilch

[iatacs19]

I am still on the fence about getting this SFF...

The only concern left is that noise, my computer is on 24/7 and I sleep in the same room. How noisy is it?

I have a Dell 400SC w/2.4ghz P4 and it's silent. This led me to look into the Dell Precision 470 with Dual Xeon 3.0ghz HT (about the same price in the end as the Zmax-DP) I can confirm that the Dell is silent even with dual Xeons, but I've never seen a Zmax-DP in person to be able to compare.

Can you please say anything about noise during full load and idle?

Thank you again.

[daiSho]

just to clarify here... i assume from the ambiguous wording on the iWill site that the ZmaxDP *does* require registered memory modules? or not..? putting my order in on monday and want to see whether i should have new ram coming as well, have quite a few 1GB PC3200 sticks over here already, but they are just regular DDR400, not ECC or registered... if anyone could settle that for me i'd be really grateful, thx all..!

[ivo]

hi all,

i got the black zmaxdp work yesterday!!! it works neat. now i know that it was deffinitively a RAM issue. I found the prolem because of a mail from a supporter of the shop where i bought the ZMaxDP. He just sent me the datasheet (http://www.valueram.com/datasheets/KVR400X72RC3A_1G.pdf) of the ram I was so said using. The packaging on the shown layout was different of the ram i used. There was a chip more, the reg. chip! In fact i ordered the right RAM but did get the wrong. When i controled the modelnumber the day it was delivered i did not see that there was a small but important 'r' missing. It was KVR400X72C3A/1G intsead of KVR400X72RC3A/1G. The sepcs i posted in this forum referred to the modelnumber that were written on my ordersheet resp. on the deliverysheet. The actual models i got were not the same.

Allover, it was really a stupid cause, a beginners fault since it is the first time i have reg. RAM. Really annoying: i brought the RAM back to the shop last monday to have it tested AND verrified. They said that it would be fine. What a group of loozers. Yesterday i brought it back again, this time to have it changed.

Without your hints I would probably not have looked at the RAM again and again. I learned a lot from your posts for what i want to thank all of you frankly.

Last but not least i will have to test the KVR-333 reg. ECC actually seating in the black ZmaxDP on the red one that is at a friends. But i think this was definitively the cause of the problem and the right RAM should work on the other machine.

Installing the machines is a different problem. I wanted to try different OS. I installed winXp64 (rc2) which is running well. 'just' the driver of the ethernet that is given from iwill does not work propperly, so i can not complet the registration and within 14 days my winXP64 will expire. does anyone have experience with winXP64. Windows2K installed first well, but afer putting iwill drivers (thet are actually not designed for it) ther was just the bluescreen. Then i tried suse9.2pro 64-bit, but yast did not find the HD because suse does not have right sata-driver included.

jsnorman: as far i can remember, you installed SUSE. did you have similar problems?

The same problem also arrived while trying to install Mandrake 10.1
and debian sarge.

the OS i actually installed and that are working completely are: winXP pro, Ubuntu (african distro built on debian) and Kanotix (german distro, also built on debian). but non of them is working 64-Bit. now i have, similar to the mac dualG5, the fastest SFF in this world, providing new 64-bit technology, running with 32bit OS ;-0. but these are smaller problems for which i will find solutions soon!

again thank for all your help...

best regards...


...ivo

[Stormlord]

Indeed Ivo,

ZMAXdp does require REGISTERED memory. Regular memory will not work. Daisho - I see that the specs on the site indeed list ECC. This is wrong. I will pass that on to Iwill Taiwan. In any case, all sticks in the compatibility list should be registered.

In any case ANY socket 940 AMD opteron system requires registered memory at the moment... I know Abit is supposedly going to release a motherboard that can handle small quantities of normal PC3200 DIMMs, but we'll see - that could just be a missprint aswell.

I usually use infineon brand on brand ECC REG memory personally - because they are quite easy to get over here..

Anyway, I'm glad the problem is solved.

Check the nVidia site for latest x86-64 beta drivers for your LAN, I have no personal experience with the x86-64 OS yet in its current state. Latest drivers I have seen on the net are more recent than the ones delivered with the barebone.

Kind Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

[hubgods]

Regarding the noise factor vs. the Dell 400SC, I actually use that exact setup as I have those systems a couple of feet apart from one another (Dell box is my Linux test system) and the Dell is quieter than the ZMAXdp that I have (and that is with HE low-powerCPUs), but not of a great magnitude. Unscientifically, I would put the Dell at ~ 20% quieter and would only recommend a low power setup of the ZMAXdp in sleeping quarters to keep the fan below 2000 rpm

[jsnorman]

Originally posted by ivo
....Then i tried suse9.2pro 64-bit, but yast did not find the HD because suse does not have right sata-driver included.

jsnorman: as far i can remember, you installed SUSE. did you have similar problems?

...ivo

You need to do the following for SuSE and most flavors of Linux:

1. Boot with option "noapic" passed to kernel. Trust me on this one. All kernels prior to 2.6.10 require this fix. If you are building your own kernel based on 2.6.10 or above, you should be able to with WITH apic enabled.

2. You need two modules to see the drives, and to get ethernet.

modprobe forcedeth
modprobe sata_nv

I am not running RAID, so I am not sure but you MAY need an additional module if running raid (or compile your own kernel and there is a raid option there for nvidia in kernel 2.6.10 at least).

I do not recall exactly when/where in the install process I was able to load these drivers, but I do recall having to do it.

By the way, the install process I went through was a little tortured.

I downloaded the free "trial" SuSE CDROM for 9.2 32-bit. I installed from that and built my basic linux system. Then, once I had everything working more or less, I redirected Yast to use a local Suse mirror as the "installation medium", only I directed yast the the 64 bit directory for SuSE 9.2. I then selected a bunch of packages not included on the "trial" cd (development, KDE, Gnome, etc.) and installed these. Finally, I had Yast do a complete update, effectively replacing most of my 32 bit system with 64 bit. This is an old trick for Yast that SuSE actually used to document. Anyway, it worked well.

3. There were some things in SUSE 64 bit that seemed broken. In particular, I had problems with Java. I tried the loads from IBM, Sun and Blackdown but no luck. It seems like SUSE enabled packages are just a little behind the more bleeding edge releases, and in the 64 bit/AMD linux build, you are on the bleeding edge by default.

4. So, last weekend I decided to try a Gentoo build. THere is a forum over at gentoo.org dedicated to AMD64, and custom tarballs (base systems tar'd) for AMD64 Stage 1, 2 and 3. I started at Stage 2 and emerge'd to Stage 3. Currently, I have everything working very well, running Enlightenment, FIrefox (64 bit), Java 1.4.2 from Blackdown, and ICAClient. Of course, each library, the kernel, everything, has been custom compiled for this machine, the optimizations for the opteron and dual SMP kernel. It is incredibly fast. Even with my pokey 240's, I run compilation using 3 parallel processes (CFLAG), and can emerge 3 packages simultaneously, while browsing the web in another window, and running ICA clietn in yet another. Basically, very fast and incredibly stable. Also, I have compiled with multilib (32 and 64 bit libs), and using Gentoo's special hardened linux options/extensions. If you go gentoo, email me - there are several stumbling blocks that I had to get over, mostly emerge build files that are broken and need workarounds. All are documented somewhere in forums.gentoo.org but you need patience and good search skills. Also, I still have not successfully compiled either gnome or KDE, but others have so maybe it is my system.

[daiSho]

can anyone tell me how large a PCI card will fit w/in the ZmaxDP? the iWill website lists no specific constraints as to card size, so if anyone could give me an idea what i could expect to fit into there w/out issue i'd greatly appreciate it..!

[duc]

Originally posted by daiSho
can anyone tell me how large a PCI card will fit w/in the ZmaxDP? the iWill website lists no specific constraints as to card size, so if anyone could give me an idea what i could expect to fit into there w/out issue i'd greatly appreciate it..!

Any standard size PCI card and upto a GeForce 6800 in size. However, the PCI slot is pretty much redundant if you have a middle to highend graphics card as installing a PCI will block the airflow to cool the AGP card. Choose your PCI card carefully.

[daiSho]

Originally posted by duc
Any standard size PCI card and upto a GeForce 6800 in size. However, the PCI slot is pretty much redundant if you have a middle to highend graphics card as installing a PCI will block the airflow to cool the AGP card. Choose your PCI card carefully.

hi duc, thx for your reply! well, my need is to get a video capture board into that sole PCI slot, the card i want in there can be seen at the link below..:

Canopus AceDiVo (http://www.canopus.us/US/products/ACEDVio/pt_ACEDVio.asp)

i do not need a super high-end graphics card in my system either, a mid-range Radeon will suit my needs fine, not a gamer... does this look doable, or am i asking for trouble here..?

i should also mention, i have two Opteron 246's that are awaiting their new home in the ZmaxDP, if i could only find it in colors other than black..!

thx for your input, have a good one..!

[Stormlord]

Daisho,

we had a few reds but I think we're sold out in Red en only have blacks left. The red ones are produced in more limited quantities. There are only two colors, unless you have a large order (probably minimum >300 to 500 pieces), in which case customisation is possible. A low to mid range videocard with a reasonably sized PCI card should work. There is no hight restriction (it's full height) and your card doesn't seem abnormally long.

You can see on these pictures you have plenty of room for your card:
http://www.iwill-benelux.com/test/ZMAXDP.html

Kind Regards,

David

[JediFonger]

what about silver? =^).

[daiSho]

Originally posted by Stormlord
Daisho,

we had a few reds but I think we're sold out in Red en only have blacks left. The red ones are produced in more limited quantities. There are only two colors, unless you have a large order (probably minimum >300 to 500 pieces), in which case customisation is possible. A low to mid range videocard with a reasonably sized PCI card should work. There is no hight restriction (it's full height) and your card doesn't seem abnormally long.

You can see on these pictures you have plenty of room for your card:
http://www.iwill-benelux.com/test/ZMAXDP.html

Kind Regards,

David

thx for your reply David, i didn't realize that it would be an issue to find a unit in red finish... i remember also seeing both white and metallic-blue on a japanese website, but they would not ship outside of japan.

can anyone suggest where i might be able to find my suddenly rare red ZmaxDP perhaps? should i just call iWill directly, any chance..?

[duc]

Originally posted by daiSho
can anyone suggest where i might be able to find my suddenly rare red ZmaxDP perhaps? should i just call iWill directly, any chance..?

Not sure where you are on the globe, www.aria.co.uk (UK) has the choice of red or black.

Has anyone tried the new bios? v1.10 (http://www.iwill.net/product_imgs/36/zdp110.zip)

Description :
1)Added smart fan control temperature setup item in bios setup menu.
2)support AMD E step cpu.

Special Note:
Caution:Procedure...
1)Update BIOS
2)Turn off computer, cool down...
3)After cool down, turn on computer
4)Entry BIOS to load optimize setup default

[daiSho]

Originally posted by duc
[B]Not sure where you are on the globe, www.aria.co.uk (UK) has the choice of red or black.

thx friend, i'm in the states actually but i might go the UK route if thats the only option... 'instant gratification' shipping would be brutally expensive i bet though..!

[duc]

DO NOT FLASH TO NEW BIOS!!!!

My initial test shows that whilst temps are same as previous bios the memory bandwidth is non-existent.

SiSoft Memory bandwidth benchmark:
v0107 int=4322 MB/s & float=4323MB/s
v0110 int=541MB/s & float=541MB/s

[busfahrer]

How can they get away with a 300W PSU on that thing?

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Hi all. Just registered. I will be getting the ZmaxDP tomorrow from Newegg. Here is what I will be hooking it up to:

Dual Opteron 248's Rev C0
1GB Samsung PC2700 (2GB PC3200 soon)
2 x Maxtor Diamondmax 10 300GB drives 16mb cache Raid 1
NEC 3500A DL DVD burner
Mitsumi 7 in 1 3.5" reader with floppy
ATI All In Wonder X800XT
Audiotrak Prodigy 7.1 (soon replaced with Mistique 7.1 With DD Live)
Dell 2005FPW
Kinesis Contour Keyboard
Logitech MX1000 and Wireless Optical Trackman and Wireless Marble FX
Windows XP SP2 as OS


Whew... Anyway, I have read through this thread several times. Given what I am putting in it and on it, are there any issues I should be concerned with? What is up with the latest bios --> yes or no to it? Are there any issues I should be concerned with? Coming from my FX51 system with 8 fans including the PSU, hopefully this will not be as deafening.

Any advice and info is appreciated. Thanks in advance!

-SVX

[duc]

Right now I wouldn't recommend the ZMAX to anyone until Iwill sort out the Bios, you might be safe with 248s the fan niose was just too much with 250s.

One question that I do have about your ({ISV-K}SVX) setup is, where on earth did you find an AIW X800xt?

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Newegg:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-492&depa=0


Good thread on it here:

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33804605&page=3&highlight=x800xt

Review posted this morning at Hexus here:

http://www.hexus.net/content/reviews/review.php?dXJsX3Jldmlld19JRD0xMDMx

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Ok....I am getting some rather high temps. CPU0 is idle at around 43 and CPU1 is idle around 53. Both celcius. Is CPU 1 the primary cpu?

What kinds of temps are your guys seeing - especially those with 248's.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Ok those readings are from MBM, but when I check HW Doctor I see the following: CPU0 36C, CPU1 43C MBM at the same time shows CPU0: 45C and CPU1: 54C. Which is correct? What settings are you guys setting the probs on for the CPU's in MBM?

[duc]

Compatibility issue with Maxtor DM10

Just RMAed my ZMAX due to reboot problems and been told by Aria.co.uk that the problem is caused by my Maxtor DiamondMax10 HDDs.

Hi,
I'm the manager in charge of the Iwill items we stock, I think we've found the root of the issue.

In your email to lee you mention that you have 2x 200GB SATA Maxtor drives, are these by chance diamondmax 10's?

We believe that there is currently a compatibility issue between the Zmaxdp and these drives which causes the warm reboot issue.

We have contacted Iwill with this issue, and it should be rectified very soon

[Stormlord]

Daisho,

I tried sending you an email but your mail bounced. I confirmed about the colours with Iwill: You are wrong about the ZMAXdp colours. They are only available in red and black. Not in white or blue. Red is only produced in ltd. quantities for Japan and Europe mainly. Black is more readily available.

ZMAXap and st are available in dark gray and white. So maybe you mixed those with ZMAXdp or you misunderstood some information you found somewhere on the internet.

Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

[joho]

I can confirm that warm-booting with Maxtor MaxLine III (I have 2 of SATA version) is not possible. A cold start (on/off) is required in order to let the drives spin-up (at least that is what I make of the sounds I hear).

Another 'problem'I have with the SATA drivers is that they appear in the 'Safely add or remove USB device' list icon in MS Windows (XP Pro).
However they can obviously not be removed as they are in use.
I assume these drives, even if SATA is hot-pluggable by design, do not belong in that list. How to remove them from this list?

[Stormlord]

This seems to be a problem with maxtor drives DM10/maxline III then, have you tried latest bios ?(1.10) I also read about problems with other SATA controllers before, so this is likely to be a maxtor issue that might be circumvented by a bios change. There are no problems with WD and Seagate I know of.

I will have this verified by Taiwan.

Regards,

David / Iwill benelux.

[Stormlord]

Busfahrer,

the supply is specifically designed to provide proper load distribution and is more than sufficient for most applications. The barebone works fine with 250's and 252's and e.g. 6800GT for example.

Duc,

there aren't that much problems with the bios AFAIK. The Maxtor issue is likely a compatibility issue with the sata controller chip Maxtor is using on the HDD. I've read about problems with desktop boards from other brands and their new 6B & 7B series aswell, so it looks like it is not an issue specific to this barebone.
I've reported this to Iwill however. I did not notice any performance problems with 1.10 BIOS, but will have Iwill take a look at that.

{ISV-K}SVX,

do not believe MBM - go for the tool that is supplied with the motherboard. MBM doesn't have suitable adjustment for the barebone I believe. CPU0/primary cpu is the cpu closest to the front of the case. The second cpu may get a bit warmer due to the fact that both heatsinks are above it and so is the PSU. I'm seeing similar 9-10 degree difference on other ZMaxDP so that appears normal. BTW.: I've had opteron run 100% load continously in the 58-62 degrees C range without issue (in a 1U server), the temps you are quoting are quite normal and not harmful to the cpu's.

Regards,

Dafvid

[kikia]

Zmax DP V110 has problem in PCI routing,
so I remove it, and put new bios zmdpv111 on
http://www.iwill.net
it fix PCI routing issue.

by the way, I have another special bios
zdpt111, it set the smart fan staring on 35 degree C when initial bios.
zdpt112, it add PXE function

if you want these bios, just send mail for me.
titanwu@iwill.net

or if you just want zmdpv111, please download from iwill website.

[hubgods]

I use a pair of 300GB Maxtor DM10 SATA drives in my ZMAXdp and can confirm that there is an issue in terms of drive visibility, though I have experienced at both cold and warm boot starts.

I am going to load the .11 release this weekend to see if it addresses the issue and will report back.

[SUOrangeman]

1GB REG+ECC DIMMS for $160US? (http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=D32RB1GW&c=pw) (now $150 on 30 March)

Any reason these won't work in a ZMAXdp? By far the cheapest price I've seen for 1GB DIMMs of this nature.

-SUO

[SUOrangeman]

I just had to make another post for this, ...

248HEs announced (http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/display/20050323030317.html)

OSK248BLBOX and OSK248FAA5BL

Aside from the cost (and availability) argument, why would one get any other Opteron to run in the ZMAXdp?

-SUO, budget buster

[aau]

Can anyone confirm this will work with only one DIMM installed?

BTW the memory compat. list at IWILL global site lists an ATP 2GB module, so the true max memory capacity must be 4GB.

[Stormlord]

AAU,

that should work just fine, but at reduced performance (only one memorychannel is used if you use one stick)

SUorangeman,

I do not know that memory, it doesn't seem like a major brand to me. Use major brand PC3200 ECC REG memory only, like e.g. Infineon, Micron/Crucial, Samsung, ATP, etc... Please pay attention to the fact that the memory NEEDS to be registered.

Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Here are my system specs:

IWill Zmax-DP - Dual AMD Opteron Small Form Factor Nforce 3 250 bios 1.11
2 x AMD Opteron 248 CPU's at 2.2Ghz
1GB Samsung PC2700 (2 x 512) ECC
ATI All In Wonder X800XT
Audiotrak Prodigy 7.1
Mini PCI 802.11 Wireless Lan Card too
2 x Maxtor SATA 8mb Cache 160GB drives in Nvidia Raid 1
NEC 3200A 16x Dual Layer DVD burner
Mitsumi 7-in-1 3.5" media reader and floppy

Windows XP SP2
Catalyst 5.3
Audiotrak driver version 2.0.012


Problem:

Can anyone confirm or deny USB problems with 1.11 bios? Certain games/apps cause some of my USB components become non-working. I have to reconnect the device to get it to work again. This only appears to happen with the front USB ports when I use my Act Labs Force RS Racing Wheel or my Saitek HOTAS Flight setup. Everything is fine until I start a game or certain apps with them connected. If I start a game, I might loose my USB keyboard or loose my Logitech MX 1000. This is not good.

Some observations on front ports:

ACT Labs
Kinesis Contour Pro USB
MX1000

Fire up games like F1 99-02, Need For Speed Underground 2 - random loss of any one or all components...Have to reconnect to get them back...almost as if a surge results in their loss

Saitek X36F USB
Kinesis Contour Pro USB
MX1000

Fire up games like M$ Flight Sim 00, M$ Combat Sim 3, Il2 - random loss of any one or all components...Have to reconnect to get them back...almost as if a surge results in their loss.

Under BOTH configs I noted HORRIBLY slow mouse cursor movement. The USB LED in the front is STILL red, the component however is nonresponsive until replugged in. Under certain circumstances, reseating did not help, however a reboot got it back.

I ran a test tonight and moved the Act Labs, MX1000, and Kinesis Keyboard to the back ports and F1 and NFSU2 ran flawlessly!!

From what I can tell only certain components cause this problem. Also note ALL other USB peripherals were disconnected when testing except my internal connection to my Mitsumi 7 in 1 3.5" drive.

I would also like to note that I have observed this behavior with certain apps WITHOUT either game peripheral connected. Kind of makes me beleive it is power related. IE fluctuations to the USB ports. However could be driver related.

USB Keys, USB Harddrive's, etc do not appear to cause these two conditions:

1.) slow USB response
2.) loss of connectivity

Has anyone else seen strange USB behavior? Any help is appreciated.

FYI - temps on my 2x248s are CPU1 - 47-50C, CPU2- 46-49C Idle

Load never seems to top 54C on CPU - I am using MBM 5.3.7...Following Settings:

CPU 1 - Winbond 3 Diode
CPU 2 - Winbond 2 Diode
Case - Winbond 1 Diode

Reboot for HW Monitor Settings...brb

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Hardware Doctor Reads the Following:

CPU0: 40.5C
CPU1: 38.0C
System: 127.0C

THAT is why I do not rely on that program. I set my Fans to spin up at 50C in the bios and they do according to MBM. As soon as CPU0 hits 50C they spin up! If I relied on HWMonitor, well, things would not be so good.


Another symptom I noted going to 1.11. Has anyone else noticed that initiating a reboot whether it be in bios or in the OS does not work correctly? As if ACPI was not working? If I save settings in bios and reboot or reboot from OS, my system just sits at a black screen unless I shut down. I have to power off and then back on to get it to come up. I have let it sit as long as 5min with no change.

These most edfinitely appear to be code related, but I would like to know what others have seen before I backlevel to 1.10. Advice would be appreciated.

-SVX

[jhaislet]

Sounds like you've got a USB power issue. Each dedicated port can only supply 500ma on its better days. IWILL might have taken some shortcuts on the front USB ports as most folks don't use them too heavily. I'd recommend trying out a POWERED USB hub and see if that takes care of the problems. LED mice alone pull almost 200ma for some of the newer ones, and I'd bet those gamepads/flight sticks EACH just about max out the port its plugged into.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Yes and the DP has 4 ports on the front and 4 in the rear. Each device is deticated to a port - total of 3 tested at 1 time. The NF chipset on the Zmax-DP supports 8 full 500mA ports. That being said, I am only using 3 - 1500mA. If they shortcut anything, they cut the front USB ports which I am trying to confirm.

Tnx for the input.

BTW - of the 3 devices tested on front USB - 2 were DC powered, one was not.

[duc]

Originally posted by {ISV-K}SVX
Another symptom I noted going to 1.11. Has anyone else noticed that initiating a reboot whether it be in bios or in the OS does not work correctly? As if ACPI was not working? If I save settings in bios and reboot or reboot from OS, my system just sits at a black screen unless I shut down. I have to power off and then back on to get it to come up. I have let it sit as long as 5min with no change.

Thats the same problem I reported a few post back, Maxtor DiamondMax 10 series HDDs are not compatible with the ZMAX-DP. It seems that the 1.11 bios does not contain a fix for it as yet.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

I don't have Diamondmax 10 harddrives tho.

[duc]

Originally posted by {ISV-K}SVX
I don't have Diamondmax 10 harddrives tho.

Thought you was going with the Maxtors? Must have changed your mind...

Originally posted by {ISV-K}SVX
Here is what I will be hooking it up to:
...2 x Maxtor Diamondmax 10 300GB drives 16mb cache Raid 1...

[{ISV-K}SVX]

I "was" going to go with them until I saw your thread about them having problems. I am waiting to buy them until after Iwill fixes the problem.

[koryo]

http://img175.exs.cx/img175/5278/iwillmobov108rp.jpg
having some problems. ...and the manual doesn't have the correct MB diagram. so i made one. need your help tho. anyone that knows the missing connectors and jumpers please stand up.

J11 rumored to be an internal USB (from Joho)
J22 factory USB, FIREWIRE, audio, leds...

CN4 unknown

CN9 guess tach and power for fan 1
CN10 guess tach and power for fan 2
CN11 totaly unknown

CN14 unknown

*NOTE* the floppy has the extra pin

SATA 1 is factory connected to external port

Boots with one DIMM in slot 2
no POST with one DIMM in slot 1

my problems:
unstable with Mushkin 184Pin 512MB ECC Registered DDR PC-3200 one or two sticks
Model# 991125
Cas Latency: 2-3-2

is this MB super DIMM picky? if it is, i have several sticks for sale.

problem two:
WTFL (Way Too F*&king Loud ...and hot)
idle temps @ 51C-55C smartfan @ 57
CPUs 244 AL step

help, i can't hear my self think.




---------=on another note=----------

roll the SATA and raid drivers into a WinXP install. i.e. NO F6 FLOPPY! you don't need to do this if you are using regular ol' IDE.

you need to know how to burn a bootable CD

\XPSP2\ is the directory i copied the XP install disk to.

the drivers you need are found in this dir \WinXP\IDE. this is the directory that the nForce exe makes.

the HardwareIdsDatabase entrys can be found in the oemtextmode file in the nVidia nForceware folder \WinXP\IDE\WinXP\txtsetup.oem
*NOTE* i used nForce4 from here (http://www.nvidia.com/content/drivers/drivers.asp) not the nForce3 drivers from iWill

make dirs and put these files here

\XPSP2\$OEM$\TEXTMODE

idecoi.dll
nvata.cat
nvatabus.inf
NvAtaBus.sys
nvcchflt.sys
nvraid.cat
nvraid.inf
nvraid.sys
nvraidco.dll

XPSP2\$OEM$\$1\Drivers\01

idecoi.dll
nvata.cat
nvatabus.inf
NvAtaBus.sys
nvcchflt.sys

XPSP2\$OEM$\$1\Drivers\02

nvraid.cat
nvraid.inf
nvraid.sys
nvraidco.dll


\XPSP2\I386 put the system drivers here
nvraid.sy_
nvcchflt.sy_

compress these two .sys drivers with MAKECAB

\XPSP2\I386\TXTSETUP.SIF edit this txt file as follows

[SourceDisksFiles]
NvAtaBus.sys = 100,,,,,,3_,4,1,,,1,4
nvcchflt.sys = 100,,,,,,3_,4,1,,,1,4
nvraid.sys = 100,,,,,,3_,4,1,,,1,4


[HardwareIdsDatabase]
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_008E = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0085 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_00D5 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_00EE = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_00E3 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_00E5 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0035 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0036 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_003E = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0053 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0054 = "nvatabus"
PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0055 = "nvatabus"
GenNvRaidDisk = "nvraid"
*_NVRAIDBUS = "nvraid"


[SCSI.Load]
nvatabus = NvAtaBus.sys,4
nvraid = nvraid.sys,4

[SCSI]
nvatabus = "nForce3 SATA controller, F6?! go to sleep."
nvraid = "nForce3 RAID controller, F6?! yeah right."

then burn a CD and go.

too many sources to list

------=end info=------

koryo

[Stormlord]

Indeed, the diagram in the manual does not match the board. I will report this to Taiwan. Personally, I've never really needed the manual for the DP though...

CN9,10, CN12 are fanheaders

J11, J23 USB

CN3 CLR CMOS

J3 internal atapi analog audio connector (for e.g. CDROM)

J22 frontpanel connection

(Good) Guesses:
CN14 firewire?
J1 audio configuration?
CN11 second serial port?

If you only install one memorystick, it needs to be in slot 2 on this motherboard. (it's the same with zpc64)

CAS2 memory causes problems on quite many dual opteron configuration. Please ONLY use CAS3 JEDEC spec memory.

244 AL step --> that is an old stepping I think, newer cpu's do run cooler...

Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

Please contact titanwu@iwill.net for support with this product.
(or Kikia on this forum)

[koryo]

didn't need the drawing either untill i wanted to hook up an internal USB.

i didn't see CN12 or J1. where abouts are they? do you mean j11?

i was unaware of "JEDEC spec memory". so what you are saying is that the RAM i just ordered won't work very well.

OCZ Enhanced Latency Series Dual Channel Kit 184 Pin 1GB(512MBx2) ECC Registered DDR PC-3200
This product has been specifically designed for use on the AMD Athlon64 FX platform and should not be used on any other desktop platform.

bummer. hey everyone, i gots lots of RAM for sale.


CPUs
so this model 244 OSA244CEP5AL is old and hot?

and the only way to quiet it down is to get the $600+ Es or the new 90nm $800+ processors?

bummer number two. i shure wish i had known. hey everyone, two new zmax-dps for sale! still in plastic.

[koryo]

*UPDATE*

i ordered OSA244CEP5AL
newegg
i recieved OSA244CEP5AU

is it correct that AU only works with 333 not 400Mhz DIMMs

is AU ok?

thanks,
koryo

[SUOrangeman]

While I have yet to get my hands on any Opterons, I would think that 400MHz RAM would just run at the slower speed. It should be backwards-compatible from a standpoint of bus speed.

With RAM prices finally letting up (here in the States, at least), only those on a very stingy budget should choose to buy something less that PC3200 even if the rest of the system will only support a slower speed.

-SUO

[duc]

Originally posted by koryo
*UPDATE*

i ordered OSA244CEP5AL
newegg
i recieved OSA244CEP5AU

is it correct that AU only works with 333 not 400Mhz DIMMs

is AU ok?

thanks,
koryo

AL & AU are C0 and CG core revisions so will work with 400Mhz ram, AH are 333Mhz

[jsnorman]

Well folks, I have been using J11 to power my card reader/floppy mitsumi combo drive. It worked well enough, until a couple weeks ago when I started to get "over-current" errors in my kernel logs. I ignored these (as they are often spurious) but soon my card reader stopped working.

Thinking maybe this was an artifact of recent kernel changes, I ignored this for a while, but then the "over-current" messages started flooding my log. At about the same time, my front panel USB stopped working. I took out the card reader and tested it - and sure enough, it is fried. Fortunately, front panel USB seems okay now that the card reader is gone.

Now, this could just be a case of faulty hardware, so I do not want to sound alarmist. But I am now wondering whether there might be a reason why iWill failed to document J11?

Anyone successfully used J11 long term?

[koryo]

> I have been using J11 to power my card
> reader/floppy mitsumi combo drive.

so this combo drive does not use an additional 5V from the power supply like floppy drives of yore?

i was planning on using a 9 in 1 USB card reader hooked up to j11. so do you think it will fry?

koryo

[jsnorman]

I don't know koryo. I sent an email to iWill asking about J11 but no response as yet. It is possible that the Mitsumi uses the floppy drive power connector, but I doubt it. It SHOULD get its power from the header on the motherboard. It could be I just had a flaky Mitsumi drive. I have another at home (different motherboard) that works great. So I just have to wait to see what iWill says. I will report here when I hear from them.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Another glitch I have found. If I have ANY non bootable cd or memory card (using the Mitsumi 7 -in 1 w/floppy) in the system on boot, it will just hang at a blinking cursor. If I remove the items power off and them back on, it comes up fine. Any ideas?

Also, is anyone else about to warm reboot with 1.11 bios? It does not matter if I am in the OS or rebooting from bios changes. It appears to reboot, but then just hangs at a black screen. I have to power it off and then back on to get it to boot.

I am also interested in knowing which header you guys are using for your internal card readers.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Well I have a few questions as I am having a hard time verifying the usb headers. Below is how things look from the front:

__..
__.. J? Black Connector
__..
_+..
___.+
________________Front Panel________IDE
___.....+ J?___________________________.....+ J11
__+.... Blue Connector_________________+.... Blue Connector


Crude diagram due to website formating posts, but I need to know what the two J?'s are. I cannot tell from the motherboard. The J11 seems to work with my USB Mitsumi meda reader when I plug it up. However, the second Blue header does not appear to work, and in fact, I suspect either has a problem or I have my polarity off (assuming it is the second USB header). I plugged up a mouse this morning to the lower header on the second blue connector using a isb to pin converter (hot pin to left as indicated in diagram) - when I powered on the pc, the mouse began to smoke. I immediately turned it off and pulled the header. The USB connector to the header felt warm, as if too much curent went through the line. Fortunately I pulled the mouse in time and it still works.

Anyway, that being said. Is the second blue header a USB header? No USB components seem to work on it unless I fried my motherboard.

[dogmeister]

hi again, this will be my spec

2 x 246
2gb corsair ecc ram
2 x 74gb raptors
plextor 716a

i am still to pick a graphics card and was looking at a 6800gt or a 6600gt.

will this machine be stable with the above considering that my 246s are the 85/9 watt variety.

ta

[koryo]

{ISV-K}SVX
thats why i made this diagram.

http://img175.exs.cx/img175/5278/iwillmobov108rp.jpg

[{ISV-K}SVX]

I saw your diagram earlier, but it does not list J23 as Stormlord mentioned. I assume it is equivalent to your CN4, but when I hooked up a multimeter to check the pin voltage I most certainly did not get USB voltage/s.

Here is how it looked when measured:

. . . . .
. . . .

Top row going from left to right - pin 4 is hot at 10V!
Bottom row going from left to right - pin 4 is hot at 10V!

If it was a USB header then top row pin 1 and bottom row pin 1 should be 5V. I confirmed this as the case on USB J11 header.

Can anyone else verify if Koryo's diagram for CN4 is in fact jumper J23 which Stormlord stated was a USB header? Can anyone else please measure the voltage to verify on that header as well?

Just an FYI - the reason I question this and began testing voltages, I used a standard single row USB header to USB female adapter to connect a mouse and test. As soon as I turned the machine on, the mouse began to smoke. I immediately shut the machine off and began my research. This same connection on J11 worked flawlessly.

[koryo]

{ISV-K}SVX
i have no idea what the connections are, i just mapped and labeled it as it reads on the MB. the boards i documented don't have a 'J23'. i have no idea what Stormlord was talking about.

mini review:

the OCZ FX 940 specific RAM works.
the lesson here is to only use sticks that are published as compatable.


...after extensive testing i have concluded the following. stunning really.
LED1 - (the green one) board power
LED2 - it's running...

to somewhat tame the heat/noise, i did as follows:

use the best heatsink paste available. GEIL 5/5 or equivalent. spread thin to win. unscrew the external flanges of the PSU. this gives you a little more room to carefully align the heat pipe assembly. ditch the fin shroud. i'm unsure of it's purpose. i noticed that after careful placement of the heat pipes the fins did not line up very well with each other. the fin shroud makes something have to give. with it on, i saw more than 7C difference between the two CPUs. with it off, no difference. smoosh each unbolted pipe block down to the CPUs to get it seated. then tighten the screws in the same manner as you would torque any bolt pattern. opposite clocking. push the PSU back into place and tighten. finally, i set the smart fan to 58. let 'em burn. AMD says they go to 70C, and i'm going to find out.


i also took the PCI slot cover off and made a duct from thin cardboard to keep the 6800 heat from dumping inside the case.
like a H.I.S. card

all of this just to make it somewhat plausible as a computer and not a jet.

dogmeister:
if you want to build a raging machine, do it in a bigger box. the second HD will hit the video card when you try and swing the cage into place. the 2Gig of RAM will do an excellent job as space heaters. basicly everythng you are planning to cram in is just about as hot as it can get.

don't get me wrong, the zmaxdp is a fabulous work of electrical and mechanical engineering, and i want to really like it. it's just too dang loud.

the iWill WILL probably be a perfect match with HE opterons, and that's exactly what i'm going to put in just as soon as they drop to a reasonable price.

koryo

[aau]

I'm about to buy a zmaxdp this weekend from a local seller. I still need to get some CPUs. I care more about heat and noise (as in, less is better) than speed, so I'm looking at 240s, 242, or 244. What is the sweet spot in terms of performance vs. noise for procs in zmax-dp? I don't want my machine to sound like a jet. It will also have 2gb Corsair XMS RAM, Geforce6800 video card, and at least three, possibly four hard drives.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

What are your temps?

Cover on with my X800XT All In Wonder I am reading the following:

CPU0: 48-50C Idle
CPU1: 49-51C Idle
X800XT: 66-68 Idle

CPU0: 50-54C Load
CPU1: 49-53C Load
X800XT: 70-74C Load

Using Motherboard Monitor 5.3.70
Using ATI Try Tools 1.0.1.538

With the cover off I have the following temps:

CPU0: 40C Idle
CPU1: 42C Idle
X800XT: 40C Idle


With the cover on everything is stable. No crashes. I would still appreciate someone testing to see if CN4/J23 is in fact a USB header.

Iwill support is all but useless and it WILL go noted in my review. I have tried the last 3 days to their US support and get dumped to a voicemail box that is either not working or full. When I have called back and told the operator, she has dumped me to individual voicemail boxes where I have left messages. I have yet to get a call back I am left with relying on the community. I will make sure in my own review that people know they are on their own if they buy this SFF. This is the 4th time I have dealt with them and I must say in my MANY yrs of dealing with OEM's and others, this is the absolute worst experience I have had.

Still, if anyone can confirm CN4/J23 with a multimeter I would appreciate it.

[duc]

aau
If you're after a balance between noise and performance then I reckon the 244s are the absolute max you should go for the ZMAX, unless that is you can get hold of some low power HEs.

[koryo]

system specs:
-------
AMD 244s
XFX 6800
2x512 OCZ FX 940 RAM
Western Digital 200GB SATA
19 in 1 USB card reader pluged into J11
Plextore PX-716A
dual Hyundai L90D+

temps via BIOS, idle
--------
Smart fan: 58C

Temp #1 25C

CPU0: 54 ~ 55C
CPU1: 54 ~ 56C
6800 GPU: 52C

Fans: ~2750 rpm


Voltages:
---------
negative on chassis


CN14

................o.....0.14....
....0.14...o..o..-12.0.....
....0.14...o..o......0.0....
.-12.0.....o..o..-12.0.....
....0.14...o..o.....0.14...


CN4

....0.0.....o...................
..12.0.....o..o....12.0.....
....3.3.....o..o.....1.88...
....0.0.....o..o.....0.0.....
....0.0.....o..o.....1.88...


koryo

[{ISV-K}SVX]

HA....I was right!! Forgive me, I used a friends analog multimeter. It must have not been calibrated correctly, hence I read 10V unlike your 12V. Regardless - it was over 10V, hence CN4 cannot possibly be a USB header neither can CN14!

That being said...DO NOT PLUG USB DEVICES UP TO CN4!! They will fry!! Two of my mice did - fortunately they were test mice.

Koryo - Thanks a lot for verifying this! I am just glad we caught it when we did. Hopefully Stormlord's J23 is not CN4. If it is, then there is going to be a lot of pissed off people!

Stormlord, can you verify if CN4 is in fact J23 as you mentioned? For many people it will appear to be a usb header as it is the same blue color as J11. If that is the case, then perhaps you should go back to your Development/Engineering team and have them re-evaluate those headers.

PS: My neg was on chasis as well.

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Ok, I have been thinking. WTF gives those voltages on those pins? 10-12V is a hell of a header voltage! Anyone got an idea? There has to be a VRM (voltage regulator module) somewhere to regulate that voltage unless it is direct from the PSU without. I don't see a VRM on the motherboard anywhere close to that header.

Anyone got ideas?

[Stormlord]

ISV etc..,

both look like USB headers to me, but I will have to have that verified. I don't have a fully working board at my location at the moment, the one I have has a problem and is removed from the system. The connectors are both green on that specific motherboard.

I've already noted this problem to Titan @ Iwill Taiwan, and he also said he wasn't happy about the inconsistencies in the ZmaxDP manual. We should have that fixed in a new PDF available for download shortly. Looks like someone took the graphical schema from an engineering design or something.

I could also post up a picture of the board I have here is the same, but it seems we both have rev 1.0 - so normally it should be the case.

Regards,

David

[aau]

I got a zmax-dp on Friday, and two procs today so I am trying to put it together but I can't figure it out and need some help. The CPUs are two 842 Opterons (I got a great deal). The problem is with these procs in the sockets, i can't get the heatsinks back on. I try to screw them in to the board but it appears the screws aren't long enough to reach the board so it doesn't work. If I remove the procs I can screw the heatsinks into the board. I'm thinking the heat spreader on the CPUs is too tall, is there a a difference in height between 8xx and 2xx series processors? I thought they are physically identical, but if not then I guess I can't use these CPUs. However If I remove the springs, washers, and rubber band from the screws that allows the screws to reach the board and I can screw the heatsinks in. Even if I do this though, after tightening each screw as much as it seems safe to do so, the heatsinks are so loose that I can move them around with my hands so they are clearly not seated properly on the processors. The base is not flat with the socket. So I'm totally confused. Do I need to replace my processors? TIA

[duc]

I know this may sound some what silly, but have you removed the black protector pads from the bottom of the heatsinks? :)

[dogmeister]

Can anyone present me with a screenshot of where it tells you what bios rev you have, either when you boot/post or go into bios.

Has anyone had a problem flashing to the latest version. I read in custom pc mag that they had to flash twice before they ran smoothly.

Thanks

[aau]

I didn't see any black protector pads. One piece did have some transparent plastic which I removed. The previous owner had 246 CPUs installed and running.

[duc]

Originally posted by koryo
i didn't see CN12 or J1. where abouts are they? do you mean j11?

Just got mine back from RMA, CN12 is just above the CD audio (CD AUX on your diagram) connector and J1 is to the right of the same connector. I have no idea what J1 is, its actually J1 & J7 together on a double column of 4pins. It could be front audio configuration settings given its locality on the board.

[koryo]

yep, there they are. right in plain view. my mistake.


iWill zMax-dp V1.1 board layout
http://img184.echo.cx/img184/2233/iwillmobov110vt.jpg

koryo

[dogmeister]

ok flashed to latest bios and tested the chips. with just ram and graphics. count 2 and both cpu0 and cpu1 temps given to me.

as soon as i add all my gear. 2hds and a plextor it still recognises 2 opterons (count 2) but when i go to check temps it only shows cpu0 but no cpu1

any ideas

should i be worried as it detects two opterons on post?

cheers\\

[duc]

Did you install Hardware Doctor utility from Autorun or browsed CD?

Browsing and installing from the ZMAX directory will install the uni-processor version intended for the Intel AP & ST. Use the one in the DK8X directory.

[dogmeister]

Duc thanks for that,

as soon as i installed sp2 xp pro everything cleared up. The bios picked pu the two processors as did the O/S. I must admit i'm very impressed with the speed of the system compared to my previous 3.6 prescott. Boot times from post are awsome. My final spec was

2 x 246's
1 x raptor 74gb (system drive)
1 x 200gb Maxtor ( storage drive)
1 x xfx 6800
1 x plex 716A
2 x Twinx Corsair 3200re Cas3 1gb stick

From bios and using the dk8 hardware doc i get idle of 33-38 C on both chips.

In the bios ( i have the latest now v11) i was able to change the thermal settings on the fan from 55 to 60 but tbh i'm not really sure what i'm doing here. Are these settings in Centigrade or Faranheit? The fans seem loud but not overly so, but i havent noticed them slow down or speed up or anything when taxing the processors. In the bios they have a speed of approx 4200rpm, again could anyone advise if this is too heavy or not and if so how do i tweak this to run more efficiently.

Sorry to ask so many questions here lads, but my knowledge and experience of multi processor setups and this SFF build is very limited. Truth be told i'm delighted with the ZMAXDP it has replaced a monolith of a PC tower and looks to be pretty useful to boot.

Thanks again.

[Stormlord]

aau,

the barebone is built to hold a max. of 2 harddiscs. In theory, you can fit 4 if you do not use an optical and a floppy or cardreader. But also note the increase in temperature caused by the extra harddrives will cause more active ventilation.

Please properly install the cpus, get the lever up: properly insert the cpu's so they drop in the sockets. Put down the lever. Remove fail from the heatsink and apply a thin layer of thermalpaste on the core.

You should install the heatsinks holding both heatsinks (properly) together and putting them down in the barebone as if they are one heatsink. (there is some information on that in the manual infact) Since the screws use springpressure, please properly align the screws and press down the screws while screwing the heatsink on the casing. Evenly distribute screwing down the heatsink so that you do not do one side at once. For screwing down the 2 screws through the heatsink you need a screwdriver with long "arm", otherwise you will not be able to reach the screws properly.

Please check page 24-25 of the ZmaxDP manual.

Kind Regards,

David

[Stormlord]

Also, I want to inform you about proper thermalcalibration procedure of the ZMAXDP:

If you flash a new BIOS and clear CMOS you MUST have the system cool down completely upon first reboot after flashing.

I.o.w.:
- cut power
- clear CMOS
- turn power on
- flash bios from a clean DOS 6.22 or DR.DOS bootfloppy or CDROM (no HIMEM or EMS loaded)
- turn power off
- clear CMOS
- WAIT FOR A FEW HOURS UNTIL SYSTEM HAS COOLED DOWN COMPLETELY (required for proper thermalcalibration after CMOS has been cleared!)
- turn on power
- restart, and set your appropriate BIOS settings.
- check system for stability
- you can now tweak your BIOS

If you do not let the system cool down properly, initial base temperatures may be too high and the system may do a thermal shutdown prematurely.

Kind Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux Helpdesk
T/F: +32-15-525501 - helpdesk@iwill-benelux.com
http://www.iwill-benelux.com - Let's Make Things Happen!

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Originally posted by Stormlord

I.o.w.:
- cut power
- clear CMOS
- turn power on
- flash bios from a clean DOS 6.22 or DR.DOS bootfloppy or CDROM (no HIMEM or EMS loaded)
- turn power off
- clear CMOS
- WAIT FOR A FEW HOURS UNTIL SYSTEM HAS COOLED DOWN COMPLETELY (required for proper thermalcalibration after CMOS has been cleared!)
- turn on power
- restart, and set your appropriate BIOS settings.
- check system for stability
- you can now tweak your BIOS


Is this Iwill's official recomendation on "any" bios update? I did clearly notice a calibration problem going to 1.11 just as you described with premature power-offs. I had to reflash several times in order to get an appropriate calibration on the thermal diodes.

Side note - I fixed the media-in-drive boot problem with media in drives, BUT I still have a problem on warm reboots. It happens both when rebooting from bios or from OS -- just hangs at a black screen. Anyone else seen this problem? It is clearly either hardware related or code related as it happens when saving and exiting bios.

[duc]

Originally posted by duc
DO NOT FLASH TO NEW BIOS!!!!

My initial test shows that whilst temps are same as previous bios the memory bandwidth is non-existent.

SiSoft Memory bandwidth benchmark:
v0107 int=4322 MB/s & float=4323MB/s
v0110 int=541MB/s & float=541MB/s

I now have my Zmax back from RMA, Aria couldn't fix the warm boot issue they are awaiting info from Iwill regarding this issue. Updated to 1.11 bios and the bandwidth problem is still there, currently using 1.07 bios is overcome this problem; games and apps run faster and smoother.

[SUOrangeman]

While everyone is currently caught up in the dual-core craze, I am very happy to see the near-arrival of the 248HE.

Froogle - $485 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSA248BLBOX)

Since you're gonna spend some serious money on a dual-Opteron SFF, might was well spend the extra $120 per CPU to enjoy the 55W version of the 248. Can there really be a better CPU for the ZMAXdp?

FWIW, the OEM version of the 248HE appears to be in the $850+ range (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSK248FAA5BL). Almost makes me wanna by the retail chips for $560 right now. :/

Current pricing:
ZMAXdp - $680 (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=56-101-809&depa=0)
Opteron 248HE - 2 x $485 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSA248BLBOX)
1GB PC3200 REG - 2 x $129.50 (http://www2.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Manufactory=&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=523%3A7858&PropertyCodeValue=524%3A7862&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=527%3A7871&description=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&SubCategory=147)
Raptor 74GB - $178 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=1733497/blsrt=1)
Seagate 400GB SATA - $288 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=5680939/prsrt=1)
BFG 6600GT Dual-DVI - $229 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?scoring=p&q=agp+bfg+%22geforce+6600%22+-pci&btnG=Search+Froogle)
MegaWorks THX 6.1 650 - $99 (http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~DPNo~513340.asp)

For backup storage, I'd likely get a second Seagate 400GB and put it in an external SATA chassis ($33.99 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=7668634) ). However, I think I'd also get more transport-friendly arrangement with an IDE Seagate 400GB ($292.58 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=5749884/prsrt=1) ) and a triple-interface chassis ($59.00 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=VD-EX-TRIPLE-K&scoring=p) ).

If my math is still good (OK, I'm really using Excel to track this stuff), I've still got over $3350 in equipment to buy. I've already spent over $1000 in keyboard, mouse, Zip drive, DVD-DL burner, dual 18" LCDs, and a multi-function laser printer. My 24" Dell LCD is strictly used for HDTV, so I don't consider that as a PC expense ... yet.

Think I've been thinking about this for a while? :p

-SUO

02 May Update: Even better prices on the 248HE

[duc]

New bios available v1.14 (http://www.iwill.net/product_imgs/36/zmdpv114.zip)

Description :1.Fix bad memory performance issue when first cold boot

I can confirm that memory performance has been fixed with this bios; just wonder if Iwill can do anything about the warm boot issue with sata raid.

[aau]

Originally posted by dogmeister
Duc thanks for that,

as soon as i installed sp2 xp pro everything cleared up. The bios picked pu the two processors as did the O/S. I must admit i'm very impressed with the speed of the system compared to my previous 3.6 prescott. Boot times from post are awsome. My final spec was

2 x 246's
1 x raptor 74gb (system drive)
1 x 200gb Maxtor ( storage drive)
1 x xfx 6800
1 x plex 716A
2 x Twinx Corsair 3200re Cas3 1gb stick

From bios and using the dk8 hardware doc i get idle of 33-38 C on both chips.

In the bios ( i have the latest now v11) i was able to change the thermal settings on the fan from 55 to 60 but tbh i'm not really sure what i'm doing here. Are these settings in Centigrade or Faranheit? The fans seem loud but not overly so, but i havent noticed them slow down or speed up or anything when taxing the processors. In the bios they have a speed of approx 4200rpm, again could anyone advise if this is too heavy or not and if so how do i tweak this to run more efficiently.

Sorry to ask so many questions here lads, but my knowledge and experience of multi processor setups and this SFF build is very limited. Truth be told i'm delighted with the ZMAXDP it has replaced a monolith of a PC tower and looks to be pretty useful to boot.

Thanks again.

I notice you are using xfx 6800. This is the same card I was using before it died on me. But I noticed that it is so long that the front of the hard drives would make contact with the video card in the zmaxdp. Did you see this problem? I thought that was dangerous so I took the card out.

[aau]

Originally posted by SUOrangeman
While everyone is currently caught up in the dual-core craze, I am very happy to see the near-arrival of the 248HE.

Froogle - $485 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSA248BLBOX)

Since you're gonna spend some serious money on a dual-Opteron SFF, might was well spend the extra $120 per CPU to enjoy the 55W version of the 248. Can there really be a better CPU for the ZMAXdp?

FWIW, the OEM version of the 248HE appears to be in the $850+ range (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSK248FAA5BL). Almost makes me wanna by the retail chips for $560 right now. :/

Current pricing:
ZMAXdp - $680 (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=56-101-809&depa=0)
Opteron 248HE - 2 x $485 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=OSA248BLBOX)
1GB PC3200 REG - 2 x $129.50 (http://www2.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.asp?Manufactory=&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=523%3A7858&PropertyCodeValue=524%3A7862&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=0&PropertyCodeValue=527%3A7871&description=&MinPrice=&MaxPrice=&SubCategory=147)
Raptor 74GB - $178 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=1733497/blsrt=1)
Seagate 400GB SATA - $288 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=5680939/prsrt=1)
BFG 6600GT Dual-DVI - $229 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?scoring=p&q=agp+bfg+%22geforce+6600%22+-pci&btnG=Search+Froogle)
MegaWorks THX 6.1 650 - $99 (http://www.ecost.com/ecost/shop/detail~DPNo~513340.asp)

For backup storage, I'd likely get a second Seagate 400GB and put it in an external SATA chassis ($33.99 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=7668634) ). However, I think I'd also get more transport-friendly arrangement with an IDE Seagate 400GB ($292.58 (http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid=5749884/prsrt=1) ) and a triple-interface chassis ($59.00 (http://froogle.google.com/froogle?q=VD-EX-TRIPLE-K&scoring=p) ).

If my math is still good (OK, I'm really using Excel to track this stuff), I've still got over $3350 in equipment to buy. I've already spent over $1000 in keyboard, mouse, Zip drive, DVD-DL burner, dual 18" LCDs, and a multi-function laser printer. My 24" Dell LCD is strictly used for HDTV, so I don't consider that as a PC expense ... yet.

Think I've been thinking about this for a while? :p

-SUO

02 May Update: Even better prices on the 248HE

How are you going to connect all these sata drives to the zmaxdp? You cannot use the external sata port and both internal ports at the same time. You could put another sata controller in the pci slot. BTW, doesn't the BFG 6600GT want a 350W power supply? I was looking at the BFG but since zmaxdp only has a 300W power supply I'm looking at PNY 6600GT instead.

[dogmeister]

Originally posted by aau
I notice you are using xfx 6800. This is the same card I was using before it died on me. But I noticed that it is so long that the front of the hard drives would make contact with the video card in the zmaxdp. Did you see this problem? I thought that was dangerous so I took the card out.


There is a technique you employ. The card can only be installed if you place it in last via the open side panel. I guess there is about 8/10mm of a gap so deffo no contact there. Infact on installation of all my hardware. The 6800 was the very last thing that was installed. People are correct that the graphics card blocks the the harddrves from swinging out. So if there are any changes to be made with regards the drves etc i would move using the following order.

Take 6800 out - swing caddy out and up - place caddy back in position - reinstall 6800 .

I have now had this system for approx 3 weeks and am very pleased. Its fast and very very stable , i have had no reboots or freezes. The only thing i will remark on is that the back psu gets very very hot so this makes any swapping round the back fairly hazardous. But i guess thats what the 4 usb ports at the front are for.

[SUOrangeman]

aau-

You are very correct about the number of SATA ports. I already own a Promise SATA50 TX4 card, and I'm expecting to use it ... unless an nForce4 version of the ZMAXdp magically appears.

Admittedly, I haven't done a lot of research on the BFG card. All I know is that it seems to outpace every other dual-DVI AGP card with a 6600-based chip. I certainly expect to keep using my Ti4600 dual-DVI card until it croaks, or there is an outrageous deal that I cannot refuse! :)

(I used to track the XFX card that nearly matches the BFG. I have read ?here? that the XFX card originally suffered from some serious fan noise, although I've also read that XFX has attempted to address that issue. So, I treat the XFX as a fallback. BFG may be exaggerating the requirements just a little.)

Now, iIf only I could find a suitable non-Creative replacement for my Santa Cruz that I could connect with the ZMAXdp, ... nForce MCP-T audio would be perfect.

-SUO

[{ISV-K}SVX]

Audiotrak Prodigy 7.1

Or if you want Dolby Digital Live - X-Mystique 7.1

[Stormlord]

DUC,

are you using Maxtor DM 10 drives? Is there a revision on the drives? Which drive firmware?

Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

[mrbee]

Hi,

now I'm on the ZMAXdp trip, too ;-)

Config:

2xOpteron 246
2x1GB Buffalo reged 3CAS
1x250GB Seagate SATA
1xFDD Teac FD-CR7
1xLG GSA4163B
1xX800XT

BIOS: 1.14

unfortunately, I've got a lot of problems with the System.

Floppy won't work, I checked the FDD on another PC -> works as it should.
Tried another FDD -> same problem.

The BIOS reportet only one Smart Fan Temperature (FAN 1).

I've tested all BIOS versions from 1.07 to 1.14 and got the same problems.

And I've followed the procedure which Stormlord reported for BIOS upgrades.

I'm helpless :(.

Regards
Thomas

[duc]

Originally posted by Stormlord
DUC,

are you using Maxtor DM 10 drives? Is there a revision on the drives? Which drive firmware?

Regards,

David / Iwill Benelux

They're DM10 6B200M0 drives, have no idea what revision or which firmware they are using. Is there a way to check?


mrbee
The BIOS reportet only one Smart Fan Temperature (FAN 1).

With the newer bioses the Smart Fan setting controls both fans.

[mrbee]

Originally posted by duc
They're DM10 6B200M0 drives, have no idea what revision or which firmware they are using. Is there a way to check?

Maybe Drive Fitness Test will do the job ?

You will find it here:
http://www.hitachigst.com/hdd/support/download.htm#Drive%20fitness


Originally posted by duc
With the newer bioses the Smart Fan setting controls both fans.

Yes I know, but the setting does nothing, if I rise the value or lower it, only speedfan does a good job.

Regards,
Thomas

[Stormlord]

MrBee,

is the floppy set on 1.44 MB floppy in the basic setup, Is it enabled in SuperIO and did you connect it properly? (tried another cable)? Did you set boot priority accordingly to boot from floppy first if that is what you want to do?

Regards,

David

[Stormlord]

DUC,

I was just asking if you could determine it somewhere (maybe Maxtor's own diagnostic tools), because we are looking for a solution for the DM10 problem - but not all drives seem to cause the shutdown issue - so maybe you have a different drive revision or firmware revision which is causing the problem. I have read MANY problems with SATA DM10 from Maxtor (on several brand motherboards). All I can say at the moment: avoid! Especially with Nforce chipsets...

Regards,

David

[mrbee]

Originally posted by Stormlord
MrBee,

is the floppy set on 1.44 MB floppy in the basic setup, Is it enabled in SuperIO and did you connect it properly? (tried another cable)? Did you set boot priority accordingly to boot from floppy first if that is what you want to do?

Regards,

David

Stormlord,

I've tried different settings as follows:

- SuperIO ->Onboard Floppy Controller ->Enabled
- Floppy A and B
- Floppy A or B
- Floppy boot first, second and last
- bought a new cable -> same problem
- both Floppies at the same time
- another Floppy

Both Floppies work on another PC with with each cable.

At first boot (after I assembled the ZMAXdp) I've got the BIOS POST message:
Floppy controller faulty

But after I've updated to BIOS version 1.07 the message does not appear again.


Maxtor harddrives do have a IDE to SATA bridge chip, maybe this is why they cause problems on the nforce chipset.

Maxtor mentioned, that their own Powermax tool is not able to work properly on nforce3 chipsets, that's why I have choosen the Hitachi Drive Fitness Test tool ;).

Regards,
Thomas

[Stormlord]

ISV,

that is my personal recommendation, but it's based on the reply I got about this problem from the Iwill FAE Titan Wu (Kikia on this forum) - so it is more or less official, yes. And yes, it's recommended to do so on ANY product.

Regards,

David

[SUOrangeman]

So, wo returned theur ZMAXDP to NewEgg?

$545 refurb (shipped) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16856101809R)

-SUO

[elec999]

Originally posted by SUOrangeman
So, wo returned theur ZMAXDP to NewEgg?

$545 refurb (shipped) (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16856101809R)

-SUO
Anyone seen these for sale at any Canadian retailers.
Thanks

[zilch]

Anyone care to share your opinion on flashing with the v1.15 bios? Look here (http://www.iwill.com.tw/product_2s.asp?p_id=36&tp=BIOS).


Description :
1.Support dual core opteron
2.Fixed Checksum error issue.

[Stormlord]

Zilch,

I think its stable.

[hubgods]

Is anyone out there using the Dual Core Opteron 875 (or 275 for that matter) CPUs as yet in their zmaxDP? I've just removed my 246 HE processors and put in a pair of 875 Dual Core ones and while I am using the latest (115) BIOS update that calls out Dual Core support, I'm still getting a "CPU not recognized Hit F1 to continue" on every reboot.

The system works fine and all 4 cores are recognized, but it is an annoyance. Thanks for any guidance!

[hubgods]

All set now - this was addressed in the new 1.16 BIOS that was just released. The BIOS and OS now correctly report Opteron 875 correctly.

[FastLaneJBUK]

Hi all,

Long time no post from me. I sent my ZmaxDP back to Aria in Feburary because it was not holding the CMOS settings and also with the last BIOS around that time it would power off extremely quickly because it thought my CPU's where running at about 30 degrees C all the time (Clearly they weren't)

Aria tested the ZmaxDP twice by putting in slow Opterons and didn't once check if it kept the CMOS settings and told me it wasn't faulty. I got them to finally retest it and again they did exactly the same. They refused to replace it or refund me but in the end I finally got a replacement (Now end of June!). Lets just say I will never be doing business with them again.

On to the replacement, it now remembers CMOS settings when powered off and as a newer BIOS hit since Feb, it no longer powers off randomly.

It does still run hot and the fans spin up all the time on my 2x250's but I've also got a 2GB's of RAM. 2 x Maxtor Diamond Max 10 HDD's (One SATA and one IDE to leave the rear SATA port working if I ever need it). XFX Geforce 6800GT. So I guess it's to be expected.

Duc, no reboot problems at all or other issues with the Maxtor drives in my case, maybe because I have one IDE model?

I also have an Intel 2200BG wireless card in the mini PCI, a Mutisumi FDD 7in1 card reader and also wired up an internal bluetooth dongle as well on the same USB header. No problems there.

Oh and an NEC 2120 I think is the model DVDRW DL drive. All in all a nice setup.

The problem is after waiting so long to resolve the problem with Aria I've got myself another system so I'm thinking about selling the ZmaxDP wih everything in it.

It works fine like I said if a little on the noisey side. If anyone in the UK wants to make me an offer or well anywhere in the world then I'll be sure to think about it :)

It's a nice rig, just Aria have screwed me around so much I just got fedup and replaced it before I got this back.

Oh everything is still under waranty and was all purchased new in Jan of this year. It's virtually unused as I had the ZmaxDP missing for so long.

Cheers,
James

[Stormlord]

Fastlane,

did you have the system completely cool down after flashing the bios.

Did you follow this procedure:
1) unplug or switch off power on the back
2) clear cmos
3) power up
4) boot and flash from clean DR DOS or DOS 6.22 floppy (no HIMEM or EMM)
5) unplug or switch off power on the back
6) clear cmos
7) HAVE SYSTEM COOL DOWN COMPLETELY FOR THERMAL BASETEMP CALIBRATION ON FIRST BOOT AFTER CLEAR CMOS
8) If system has cooled down (can take several hours, but you can speed it up with a dry air spray or larger fan), you can restart

In many cases this solves problems with thermal shutdown of the system.

Kind Regards,

David

[FastLaneJBUK]

Hi,

Well the main problem I had with that ZmaxDP was it would not hold it's CMOS settings. This new one has been fine in that regard.

The problem with it shutting down, I'll never know if that would fix it because I no longer have that box. However I noticed the BIOS that came out afterwards mentioned something about fixing CPU readings. Maybe your right as I didn't let it cool down as I've never come across anything like that before with BIOS flashes.

Thanks for the advice though :)

[northernmonkey]

hi

gave up on the idea of buying a dk8n couldnt find a cheap case and im now the proud owner of a zmaxdp! :D

its got

2 x 246 CO (the hot ones)
200 sata seagate
80gig ata seagate (from old pc)
2 x 1gig pc3200 ecc cheapo ram (100% stable and tested)
sony drw500 or something like that again from old pc
gainward 6600 128mb

ive read through the whole thread and there are a couple of things i need to know

1st the temperature
hw doctor says the cpus are around 10 c below the value speedfan says. should i just recalibrate it
also the temperature of the hard drives is approaching 50-55 i was thinking of making a bracket and mounting a 40mm fan to blow air over them from the side vent good idea or bad idea?

2nd the bios

what the hell does the smart fan number relate to?
i set it to 52 and the cpu temp went up to around that figure and the fans went to around 3k to 3.5k.
set it to 45 cpu 45ish fans 2 - 2.5k
set it to 40 cpu 40ish fans 2k hard drive temps went up a lot
set it to 30 cpu 30ish fans minimum thought hard drive was going to set on fire 55
all preformed whilst computing radisoity in max 7 to load the cpus up
the manual says there is a cpu throttling option but this is in its place. i didnt notice if this affected preformace, thats tonites test but id like to be able to get the most power out of my opterons with the fans hitting 3k max

3rd

should i be worried about the psu getting rather hot, its not going to suddenly die on me is it? iwill website says that it is tested with a pair of 250s and the cg versions give out the same 89w as my 246s

sorry for all the questions i just want to stop worrying that my flat might burn down every time i hit render on max

[pinnocchio]

Hubgods

Did you ever run the dual cores in your zmaxdp for a period of time?

If so have you had any issues or problems?

TIA

P

[northernmonkey]

so finally got round to sorting out my rig, i tried using a 3 pin 40mm x 10mm fan i had from a old heatsink. i mounted it above the battery facing my two drives, without the case on the temps of the harddrives rose a little then settled down, then i put the case back on and it made NO difference, ok a little they didnt heat up as quickly but still reached the same temps as the proccesors.

Then i got the 80mm x 20mm from my old case (2 pin take off from molex), it just fit between the end of the graphics card and the front of the case, with the top right mounting hole been aligned with the thumbscrew for the hard drive cage. (im thinking a 92mm fan would fit, but it might touch the battery) using a bit of thick wire to hold its position i fired up the computer with out the cover, the temps rose around 2-3 degrees and remained stable at around 38 and 42 (i think). i then treated my self to a cool beer and max finished then radiosity solution.

Putting the cover back on the temps rose in parabolic curve from cold to a temp of 40 - 45ish after 20mins full load. At the same time i hit defrag on the old drive mounted in the top bay and the temp flucuated around 2 degrees withe the opterons around 50 to 55 depending on the fan speed. the noise from the fan wasnt noticable over the ones in the power supply. next job is to try and make a small duct from the side vent to fan and see what that does.

also thinking of trimming down a pci system exhaust placing it above the power supply/heatsink and ducting across the pci/agp slot down and out of the vent at the side. that part of the case seams to get a lot of stale hot air stuck.
I dont want modify the case as it would possible void the warrenty, but i dont know how i stand anyway as i bought it off ebay.

[aau]

Hi folks,
I haven't posted in this thread in a while, since I haven't had time to sort out my ZmaxDP system lately, but I'm still having some problems with it. I'm posting from my ZmaxDP right now, the biggest problem is it keeps shutting off at random. After I boot into XP Pro 32-bit, it'll power off w/o warning after a random amount of time. Is this because of a heat issue? In the bios hardware health configuration the Smart Fan setting is at 42 which I think is the default. Is this the temp that triggers a power off? If so, that seems kinda low. What is the highest temp that's safe and recommended here? My machine is pretty stuffed with hardware, it has 2x244 CG stepping, 2x1GB Corsair TwinX RAM, Geforce 5200 Ultra GPU, and four hard drives, 1 Seagate 80gb SATA, 1 Hitachi 400GB SATA, and 2 Maxtor 80GB PATA. I'm booting off the Seagate SATA and use USB for Floppy and optical. I'm running the 1.16 BIOS and used the procedure detalied in this thread for flashing. (BTW, the fans go crazy when I first power on after flashing, what does this mean?) TIA

[pinnocchio]

If so were there any issues or problems?

TIA

P

[northernmonkey]

some people have used dual cores in them, from what i can remeber earlier in this thread, they kick out a bit more heat than a CO or CG single core. i thought that they had PowerNow! in them that would help keep them cool. But compatability wise the bios has supported them for a while, and i havent heard any issuse yet.

aau

i had a random reboot last night i was copying files from cd to SATA and mounting a cd image in nero image from sata and something else at the same time, screen went blank moniter power button flickered then about 7 seconds later it began to post, i didnt even realsing that it was rebooting, windows started as if it had been shutdown normally. how random is your random shutdown?

also the fans on mine go full speed for about 3 seconds then slow down

[pinnocchio]

Reading the spec i think it should....I know it'd be better as a pair but there's only one available.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=6786444674&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

TIA

P

[aau]

Originally posted by northernmonkey

aau

i had a random reboot last night i was copying files from cd to SATA and mounting a cd image in nero image from sata and something else at the same time, screen went blank moniter power button flickered then about 7 seconds later it began to post, i didnt even realsing that it was rebooting, windows started as if it had been shutdown normally. how random is your random shutdown?

also the fans on mine go full speed for about 3 seconds then slow down

Mine is not rebooting, its powering off completely, I can't predict when it happens, sometimes minutes, sometimes hours after going into Windows, even if its idle. Rebooting may or may not be the same issue. I think some warm reboots are related to certain Maxtor drives.

[northernmonkey]

I think mine might have been a one off, or a really short power cut. The old computers PIIs etc and withstand a power cut of up to a second, where as the new k7s and p4s shutdown as soon as the lights flicker.
No problems with the hard drive seagate all the way ;)

how hot is the power supply getting touchable? touchable for 1, 2, 3seconds? and does it do random shutdowns if you leave the case off?

last thing i can think of is the settings in the bios, under power management(?), the stay off/reboot etc after power loss might be something in that menu that could help you

pinnocchio

You can always give the ram a go, no reason why it shouldn't work. and if it doesnt just resell it back on ebay or in the for sale area. A 2gig stick is hard to come by at a good price

Also do a quick check on the height of it i know in my case there is not a lot of room between the HD cage and the ram

[FastLaneJBUK]

I'm not convienced it would be Maxtor HDD's as I have 2 x 300GB Diamond Max 10's in mine with no problems at all. The ZmaxDP is always on. I find this is a good way to heat that room to about 45 degrees celcius all year round. Lol.

Maybe you should try switching the fan headers around so the fans always run at full speed. It's damn noisy of course but at least that would give you an idea if it's a thermal cut out which is causing your machine to power off. If it works then switching it back and lowering the smart fan setting could well solve the problem.

As for the rebooting. If your on Windows XP go to the System Control Panel, Advanced, Startup and Recovery settings and tick off Automatically restart in the system failure box. If it's blue screening then you'll get to see the blue screen instead of just rebooting so quick you don't even know what happened. Assuming it is bluescreening. The bluescreen error messages should help narrow down what the problem is.

Also maybe leave it running a memory test like memtest86 (It's free) to see if that throws up any problems.

Hope this helps.

[northernmonkey]

Originally posted by FastLaneJBUK
I find this is a good way to heat that room to about 45 degrees celcius all year round. Lol.


Its a pain in summer but at least ill save a bit of cash on my gas bill this winter :D

[FastLaneJBUK]

Yeah indeed. I've seen a hell of a lot of computers in my time but nothing beats the heat output of this baby.

Yeah it is a pain in the summer, no longer does opening the window help so now have to have a large fan in the room to add to the noise. It's bearable then :)

[iatacs19]

Broke down and ordered after Dell cancelled my Precision 380 order 4 times!! I have never used anything but intel since 1993. :)

I got:

- Zmax-DP black
- 2 x Opteron 244 (1.8ghz ones, Rev. AU, CG stepping)
- 2 x 512MB Kingston PC3200 FBGA chips, these should run cooler and consume less power (KVR400S4R3A)
- Need a low heat, low power hdd, might go with Samsung hdd..
- Recycle my Asus DVD-ROM
- Recycle my ATi FireGL X1
- Recylce my Turtle Beach Santa Cruz (any problems?)
- Recycle my external USB 16x DVD-RW
- Recycle my external firewire 320GB hdd
- Need to find a floppy + card reader for the floppy space
- I have some Ceramique thermal grease, anything better?

I will post again after I try it out. Can't wait. :D

[The Doctor]

Why recycle the Turtle Beach sound card? I'd have thought that the built-in sound capabilities of the nForce3 chipset were at least as good.

[iatacs19]

What version of WindowsXP do I need to install on a SATA drive?

I ordered a Samsung 200GB SATA, and I have been reading that WindowsXP doesn't have native SATA support? I don't really have a floppy available either...

Is the SATA on the nForce3 recognized by WindowsXP or did you have to do the F6 and specify drivers for it?

Thanks...

[The Doctor]

Windows XP pre-SP2 has no native support for SATA as SATA wasn't available back in those days. So yes, you have to do the "press F6 and specify a third-party RAID/SCSI driver" thing. Unfortunately XP has a bug where it will only accept these via floppy...

[northernmonkey]

I Think i have solved my random reboot problem! :D

thanks to a brief (before reboot) error message about a scratch disk in photoshop

Now when i first got this the only sata cable that was in the box was a straight one (no right angle connector) so i removed the exteral cable and used the staight one to external port and the right angled end to the drive, i know sounds bad looks bad but it works (ish :rolleyes: ). as the drives are so close to the edge of the case the sata cable can get knocked when replacing the case or nugded in to a position where connection is flaky at best.
solution move the cables around so that the case is not touching the cables.
If you have a Pata and SATA drive in the drive cage you must know how packed the area is. i had to remove an sata power connector off the extension piece so the cover would fit on.
http://www.2cpu.com/gallery/ZMAXdp/zmaxdp_060
this picture shows just an pata but imagine trying to fit a sata in the lower and pata in the upper with all the assosiated power cables etc.

now all i need to do is find some right angled sata cables

[iatacs19]

what version do you have on your motherboard? Mine has 1.0, but I recall seeing a picture that had 0.91 and 1.1??

Does it matter? what has changed?

[peedub]

This is my first post (and a long one - sorry) - I have been lurking here for a while, gathering the necessary info for my own ZMAXDP setup.

I thought that I'd share my experience of putting the system together and have a few questions regarding CPU temps.

I got the ZMAXDP from an eBay auction and spent a couple of weeks getting together all the components: -

2 x 244 Opteron (CG Stepping)
1 x 1Gb DDR400 ECC registered RAM (Super Talent)
80Gb Maxtor IDE HDD
Mitsumi FDD / card reader

Taken from my old setup: -

Sony DVDRW
ATi FireGL 8800 Graphics Card


After putting all these components together for the first time, I hit the power switch only to find the fans going at top speed and no POST. A complete strip down and re-assembly gave the same result. The primary suspect was the memory; I got it from Scan (GBP 84) after emailing to check that it was compatible. It was the cheapest available and I guess I knew I was taking a chance on it - being a student, I had to try and keep costs down. A check on the forums saw that someone else had also had a look at this RAM but had rejected it (didn't state why).

So I bit the bullet an ordered 2 x 1Gb Corsair TwinX matched pair from Scan (GBP 240) and returned the Super Talent stick.

Once this was installed I managed to POST and to install Windows XP SP1 but the system would shutdown randomly both during and after install. After a while the intervals between shutdowns grew shorter and left to cool down overnight, the interval between shutdown was longer. This was obviously a temp issue even though the BIOS was reporting CPU temps of around 48 degrees. Again a check on the forum gave me the thermal recallibration procedure so I gave that a go (after going out and getting a box of floppy disks as I haven't had to use one for years and didn't have any in the house).

So now I have a SP1 installed and it doesn't shutdown prematurely. I try to install the NForce drivers so that I can go online and update Windows only to find a warning saying that I need to install DirectX. The driver does install though and I connect to the MS website only to find that my copy of Windows is not genuine!! It was given to me by my IT consultant friend and it seems he forgot to tell me that he had already registered it. MS now requires authentication of Windows before any updates, so I was stuck.

Again, I had to bite the bullet and ordered OEM WinXP SP2 from Ebuyer.

So now I have it all up and running. I have also taken two SATA HDDs from my old setup for a total of 3 HDDs. I have taken out the FDD and put on HDD in its place. This required a careful re-shaping of the screw holes in the aluminium drive cage with a round needle file.

It has taken me a month from initial purchase of the barebones system to the the (nearly) final setup. All that remains is for me to put the cover on which will require another take-apart as I used SATA cable with straight plugs which stick out too far at the side to allow the cover to be put on. I will need to strip it all down so that I can remove the cable attached to the SATA port at the rear and the spare cable with the angled plug so that I can use these.

Final system: -

2 x 244 Opteron (CG Stepping)
2 x 1Gb Corsair TwinX DDR400 ECC registered RAM
Sony DVDRW
80Gb Maxtor IDE HDD (in FDD position)
120Gb Western Digital SATA HDD
200Gb Seagate SATA HDD
ATi FireGL 8800 Graphics Card
WinXP Pro SP2

It has been frustrating process putting this together. I have only ever put one other system together before - my old Athlon XP PC that is now going to my father-in-law. That build went extremely smoothly compared to this.

I hope that it will be worth the effort and (extra) expense. The reason for the upgrade was that the Athlon PC just wasn't cutting it when it came to rendering my Alias Studiotools models.

Sorry again for the long post but it was good to get it off my chest! And thanks for this thread - it has helped my in my own build a lot.

[northernmonkey]

Welcome to the forum!!

I used the same cheapo ram you did from scan. Mine worked fine, even passed memtest86 with no errors, havn't benchmarked it yet but i bet its slower than the corsair stuff.

I dont know if Alias Studiotools is multi threaded but when i went from single athlon 2100+ to dual opteron the difference was nothing short of phenomenal. Even single threaded apps seam better when they crash, the system no longer freezes.

Anyway hope you enjoy your new creation

ps what colour case did you get?

[peedub]

The renderer in Studiotools is multithreaded - you need to choose powertracer in the render menu instead of raytracer.

I haven't had a chance to test it fully yet as I seem to be having trouble with the graphics card. Studiotools complains that I don't have OpenGL installed and the display is very laggy. It work perfectly in my old system but not in this one, so it looks like I'm in the market for a new card as well.

I got a black case - it goes well with the rest of my setup which is all black and silver.

I forgot to ask about CPU temps and Smart fan.

Hardware monitor is reporting temps of around 48/50 degrees (cover off) and yet the fans are going full tilt (5,000 rpm).

Can I adjust this in the BIOS?

[uOpt]

Tips when you have trouble with RAM on Opteron systems:

all support ECC memory but ECC checking is turned off by default in the BIOS, at least on my Rioworks it was.

Turning it on will give you a clue whether your crashes are memory related or something else.

[northernmonkey]

I meant to say preformance in max, should really check what i write before hitting post. :p

the smart fan setting on mine is around 52. from what i can tell this is the trip temp at which the fans begin to go above the default of 2000 then get quicker and quicker if the cpu doesnt cool down.

Have you got the latest bios, as the first few to be released made the fans go at full speed no matter what, and had issues with the temps reported.

Also i know that Hardware moniter is the program recommended, but the temps it reports are not accurate. ive been using speedfan (freeware) which is giving a reliable reading. for example when the cpus reach 53 ish and the fans begin to speed up, it actually shows this, HWM just said the temps are constant, yet the fans are speeding up. it also shows smart info for hard disks.

I got really confused with Hardware moniter, gave speedfan a try and all became clear :)

[Rqyteqto]

I would second trying SpeedFan. Its not the simplest program to use, but it can certainly deliver the goods and the author is more than willing to work with you on specific issues. Especially nice is the graphing function.

But, you absolutely have to read everything about SpeedFan and get to understand how it works. You can set it up to use just about any sensor or combination of sensors to control any fan or combinations of fans for just about any condition.

There are some tutorials posted in Sudhian SFF Tech forum, but you'll have to search for them.

[iatacs19]

2 x Opteron 244 CG
2 x 512MB PC3200 Kingston
1 x Samsung SP2004C
1 x Asus DVD-E616P2
1 x Mitsumi 7-in-1 floppy + card reader
1 x ATi FireGL X1
Default BIOS settings except for: MPS 1.4 and enabled all ACPI settings, also decreased the CPU1 to CPU2 speed from 1000mhz to 800mhz.

Ok, got my replacement RAM from Newegg and it's still the same TSOP sh*t no FGBA... anyway

Installed everything and it is a very tight fit in there. Didn't have any issues with the SATA since I used XP+SP2. I had to plug in my SATA drive to secondary SATA port because the external port was already connected to port1. It boots fine from Master port2, so I am guessing it's not a problem. I have my DVD drive as Master PATA port1.

Updated the BIOS to v1.16 which was the latest on iWill's site. Had to make a CD since iWill never gave me a floppy cable.

Everything looks good except for the damn noise!! It's driving me crazy, the fans are running at full speed all the time in Windows under idle. When I go into the BIOS the temps are CPU01=55C and CPU02=56C. I have the SmartFan set @ 59C since the MAX temp for Opteron is 70C. After I shutdown since I couldn't take the noise anymore, I touched the outside of the power supply and it was really HOT.

I re-installed the heatsinks several times to make sure they were seated right and I followed the screwing order and everything. I applied Ceramique exactly like the webiste told me to, with the little grain of rice style and squashing it. I don't know what is going on with the temperatures, it is a clean XP install and I haven't installed anything else. (Interesting note on my heatsinks, they came with aluminum shrouds glued to the sides and that aluminum cover we saw in the pics as well)

Next, I will move the hdd to the upper slot under the floppy instead of the bottom slot. I guess if the heatsink gets a little more clearance on top it might help, but then it's a heatpipe so I might actually end up blocking the airflow?? I will redo that calibration Stormlord posted although I have already done it...

Also, when I go into the BIOS and try to look at the HyperTransport settings that whole tab is blank... My firewire hdd is not detected, but it shows up fine in USB mode(it's a dual mode USB/IEEE hdd)

Would it be a good idea to move my DVD-ROM and hdd outside the case? I could purchase an external firewire enclosure for the DVD-ROM and an external SATA for the hdd. I would assume the hdd would be no different than being connected inside? right? same perfomance minus the heat. and I could daisy-chain the DVD-ROM to my external firewire hdd... I wonder if it would even make a difference in respect to the high fan noise... I might just have to wait for the Opteron HEs to drop in price, hopefully I don't go deaf before then.

[northernmonkey]

What is your ambient tempurature? Mine got really hot when it was warm a while back.

I used the paste that came in the box, i dont know about using a rice grain sized amount, how big is a typical grain of rice :confused:

try running it with the case off and see if the fans are still at full speed, it might be that you have a bad bios, or worse a duff motherboad :(

Have you got the firewire port installed in device manager, could be a driver problem or the port could be firewalled

[iatacs19]

My ambient temperature is 25C

I did it just like this: Instructions from Arctic Silver site (http://www.arcticsilver.com/ceramique_instructions.htm)

I will try to run it with the case off as well.

I do think the firewire was firewalled, I will take that off and try again. I haven't used SP2 until now... :D

I will try speedfan once I get home. :D

[peedub]

Speedfan (thanks for the tip northernmonkey) is reporting 58 and 63 degrees idle (cover off) for my 244s. Fan speed is about 3,000 rpm, smartfan is at 62. This is after a 50 min render in Studiotools where fans go full blast but temps stay the same.

I have some arctic silver paste on order so I can strip it down and rebuild it. I'm wondering if my higher temps are due to the HDD I've got in the FDD bay.

Apart from the fan noise, I'm loving this machine so far. The same scene took 1hr 20 to render on my old Athlon XP 2500 system.

[northernmonkey]

Is the ambient temp taken from that other temp sensor? Mine say its 25 degree all the time, never changes, even when the temp outside was 28 - 29 (according to the weather man - it felt hotter) and the components in the case were frying.

Im getting a temp diffence of 2-3 between the cpus under load from my 246s, its scary when you hit render, it sounds like its going to take off.

The position of the hard drive made no diffence in my case, which ever hard drive was closest to the cpu got hottest, the cpu stayed the same. Dont forget the laws of thermodynamics (i graduated in physics) heat flows from hot to cold, your hard drive is almost always going to be colder than the cpu (hopefully).

And dont forget convection that void above the power supply gets HOT, very hot, im still working on a way of venting that air away without modding the case.

Ive not used SP2 before this install either, a friend installed it on there running system on it messed almost every thing up. The new laptops we got at work had it on from new and they worked fine, so i came to the conclusion of only installing sp2 on any system when doing a full clean install, it was on one of these laptops that i noticed the firewire was firewalled by default.

I should really try my ipod in the firewire port. Ive just been too busy getting scared by Trigens in farcry :eek:

[northernmonkey]

Oh NO

just got a error with

\windows\system32\config\system i know

how to repair it but its a pain in the ar*e. from what ive found it is usually causedby ram, ide cables or power supply. As its an sata drive i blame that stupid cable i keep meaning to replace.

[iatacs19]

Ok, I think I am returning this puppy. It's very nice and all, but I can't stand the noise.

My idle was around 56C and 60C for cpu01 and cpu02 respectively.

Full load was strangely about the same 60C and 64C.

Ambient sensor was stuch @ 25C all the time, hdd was @ 40C

Few things I noticed, there is not much open space for the fans to push out air. The power supply is really blocked, only about 25% of the area is not blocked for the fans to be able to exhaust the hot air. The fan on the left side is completely blocked by the components inside the power supply. The noise comes mostly from turbulence and pressure created by the fast moving air that can't exit from the case fast enough. I also noticed that the right side of the power supply, when looking from the back, has this clear plastic sheet blocking the exhaust holes of the power supply. All this just adds to noise and heat. The plastic is probably there for some reason, but it obviously does not help cooling.

The system in itself is very stable, no crashes or reboots, but like I said the noise is just too much for me. The only other real problem I have is that the firewire does not recognize any devices, plugged in the hdd and nothing, plugged in my ipod and it charges, but it does not detect it.

Too bad I have to take that 15% restocking fee from Newegg, but I already placed my order again for a Dell Precision 380 with a dual-core intel. I know it's not as good as the Opteron, but I know that Dells are at least very quiet.

Maybe when the zmax-D2 comes out or when Opteron HE or EEs become cheaper I might give it another try.

[uOpt]

Not sure this is a useful contribution to this thread but maybe it's helpful.

I always knew that bigger doesn''t mean quieter.

But in the last year I have been building systems exclusively in cases where I had all the feedom I wanted to place big diameter fans, and many low-RPM fans. And where I can use cardboard to put between harddive and case wall. And that are made of steel.

Now I happily allocate the required space for big towers. They are like Swedish friends - they might be big but they are a pleasure to be around.

This conclused the philosophical lesson of the day.

Besides, they make good drink stands.

[peedub]

I've re-pasted the heatsinks to no effect. Although temps should go down another 2 - 5 degrees after 200hrs of bedding in it would still mean temps in the mid 50s. Removing one of the HDDs didn't bring the temp down, neither did a PCI slot fan.

I'm getting 58 and 62 idle with the cover on at the moment which seems a bit high considering the max temp of the 244 Opteron is 70 degrees.

I built this system myself, so I can't return it to anyone and can't afford to get another system. The noise is too much - fans are at 4K rpm most of the time, so I'm going to have to fix the heat/noise problem myself.

I'm considering using an ATX PSU externally and fabricating a duct to mount a 120mm fan (or 2 x 80mm) where the current PSU hole at the rear of the chassis is. Hopefully this will mean better airflow out the back of the case. Has anyone taken the PSU completely out of the case?

I also had to modify a straight SATA cable plug so that it would bend at a right angle so that I could get a second SATA HDD into the bottom of the drive cage. Why didn't iWill supply two of the right angle connectors?

[matboy]

Hi all, I'm a newbie thinking of going for a zmaxdp - but a bit worried about heat and noise.

A question for those of you who have already built systems; Do you think it would be possible to remove the power supply unit (thereby letting the fans run easier and quieter), and using a standard (maybe fanless) PSU sitting loose outside the case, with cables running into the case (or via custom connectors on the rear)?

Cheers,
-Mat

[Stormlord]

Matboy,

the system fans of the PSU also cool both CPU, please keep that in mind. No way you can get this entirely passive within the housing and also note that the PSU NEEDS to be EPS12v and it has to meet certain specs, not ATX I'm not saying it is impossible, but you there are some thermalrequirements to be met for cooling dual opteron in such a small housing. If you are going to change that, you'll do it at your own risk.

About thermal,
we can operate 2x275 opteron in it with a decent videocard, so it is possible - but higher speedgrades cpu's will require to increase the standard ventilationspeed setting to prevent overheating. It also depends on your use, if you are often going to use the system at 100% load continously you'll ofcourse need to adjust your settings for the ventilation accordingly.

[northernmonkey]

post in the Cases, Power and Modifications section for the power supply i think somepeople have been using the latest spec atx power supply with an adapter (20 to 24pin and 4 to 8pin) but check first

The fans in the power supply are 70mm so the gap left is around 140mm x 70mm, depending on how the cables are routed through the gap left i think a 120mm fan might fit as there is space above the power supply.

Ducting would be needed to pull the air over the heatsinks like stormloard said

I was thinking about getting a Zelman Reserator and fitting that in but id lose portability and im poor after buying my system, initial research suggests that its powerfull enought to cool dual opterons and video card, but the water blocks would need to be custom made or modded.

I highly recommend fitteing a 80mm (or one that fits) between the graphics card and front of case. I removed the one i fitted when testing a new sata cable i got (cos of reboot problem) and the drives were hot to touch.

without fan diff between cpus was ~6 degrees
with fan diff between cpus was ~3 degrees and lower hard drive droped 8 degrees with the case off on an unloaded system

see how peedub does with his i might try it on mine when im not so busy

peedub i know how you feel with the cable only got one right angled with mine, and it was crap the new cable i bought seams to have solved all my problems..... except the heat ;)

[ivo]

its nice to hear about your plans for customizing the cooling system.

my idea is also to get system less noisy. but my temp-problems are slightly different. the temperature of the cup's never goes over 45 deg. my usual readings are e.g.: cup1 40, cup2 28. the hottest pieces in the barebone are clearly the chipset and the VRM's; followed by the RAM and finally the hard disks.

first, i removed the sata-disks that were ill functioning under that heat load (outside they work fine). I also removed the floppy and i have the front slot permanently open. This should improve the air flow in the case.

Without the hd, I now have the place to put a 40mm papst on the heat sink of the chipset. I also ordered some heat spreaders for the RAM. As soon i find a solution for the air flow cooling the heatsinks of the VRMs i can change the smartfan temp in the in the BIOS to let's say 55-60 deg (in the bios v115 it is set to something like 42deg. and this makes turn the fans crazy).

i will see, in fact, i think it might be less noisy but it will never become quiet...

cu


...ivo

[iatacs19]

The problem that I noticed with this system is a very simple one.

The airflow is non-existent.

The fans are very capable of cooling the system, but there is a fundamental flaw that no review was able to tell us. The hot air cannot be removed from inside the case fast enough. Although the fans spin a whole lot, there isn't enough of an opening to exhaust the heat outside the case. Thus, the whole inside becomes heat-soaked.

The problem lies in the fact that the power supply has a very small opening to push the air out, I would say about a 5cm x 7cm MAX. The fans have a decent CFM but it's no good when they are blocked. I looked though the back of the power supply and it's horrible, the right side has a clear plastic covering the holes and the middle as well as the internals of the power supply blocking the air flow. So the right fan is not actually doing much, it is spinning, but it can't remove the heat from the heatsink since the hot air has nowhere to go fast. You can test this out by just looking straight through the power supply from the back with a flashlight. Can you even see any part of the heatsink on the right side??? If you can't then there is no way air can move out fast enough since it is being pulled through the thin copper plates then it hits the brick wall inside the power supply and creates turbulence...

The key to cooling down the system and reducing the fan noise is not to add more air movement inside the case, but to create a larger opening to exhaust the hot air from INSIDE to the OUTSIDE. To do this the best way is to first remove that clear plastic blocking the holes in the power supply, I am not sure why it's need right on the holes, it can easily be cut around the power supply hole area without any negative effects that I can see. Of course be really careful if you are going to open the power supply.

After having examined the system, I think iWill should have paid more attention to the internals of the power supply to allow for more airflow than now. A better design would have been to place the fan sideways between the 2 heatsinks and have a hole on the right side of the case to remove the hot air, at least there would be some much needed unblocked flow of air, and much less turbulence, but then I guess the mouting would be an issue...

On a side note, I got my Dell Precision 380 and it is whisper quiet. Not as exciting as the zmax-DP of course, but much more QUIET. I can sleep at night again.

Good luck everyone.

[pinnocchio]

Just to let UK people know that ARIA.co.uk have dropped the price of the zmaxdp quite a lot.

I have no link to aria, just letting people know.

Regards

P

p.s. any word on the Zmaxdp2 yet?

[northernmonkey]

They were that price about six months ago, then they put the price up now its back down again. I was going to buy mine before they increased the price, but they ran out of stock and put the price up by the time i had the cash :(

Has anyone had problems with the power supply not giving enought juice? After 2 hours in farcry, the harddrive pinged, the sound went funny and the dvd drive spun up to full speed again. After a reboot the dvd drive wasnt reconized (didnt touch any cables). Another reboot gave me "detecting nvidia array", dont have an array so i powered down for 2 minutes then started up fine as if nothing had ever happened. Strange.

Also tried pulling the power supply out to sort the ventilation only to discover that to remove it you have to pull it in to the case then out, didnt want to take the whole thing apart again so i left it.

For now.....

[Stormlord]

iatacs19,

the powersupply is made by somebody else, not by Iwill - but I will pass on your remarks to the ZMAX product manager. ZMAXD2 will have another PSU.

Pinnochio,

sampling is expected for late august/early september, mass production for later in Q4.

Kind Regards,

David

[jsnorman]

Originally posted by northernmonkey
Has anyone had problems with the power supply not giving enought juice? After 2 hours in farcry, the harddrive pinged, the sound went funny and the dvd drive spun up to full speed again. After a reboot the dvd drive wasnt reconized (didnt touch any cables). Another reboot gave me "detecting nvidia array", dont have an array so i powered down for 2 minutes then started up fine as if nothing had ever happened. Strange.


Hmmm. Why do you think this is a power supply issue??

I had the same thing happen, only when I powered back up I had permanently damaged hard disk sectors that made a key partition useless so I sent that drive back on RMA and reinstalled my whole system. I put in new, better hard drives (this time, using 2 drives in mirror configuration raid 1).

After using this system for a day, I started getting hard drive read timeout errors!

So, I theorized heat was the culprit and removed the cover. So far 4 days no errors until today.

Today, though hard drives are humming away, my ethernet seems to have died!!!

I was thinking the problem might be the chipset (which controls both IDE/SATA and ethernet) cooling - that it might need active cooling.

I had not thought about power supply though. It would make sense that power fluctuations could do the same, damaging the hard disk, though I am not sure how it could damage the ethernet port.

But your description of the problem is so close to what has happened to me so far, that I am very curious now.

[uOpt]

You can ask most modern harddrives how hot they are.

The capability is called S.M.A.R.T. and you can probably download a small program to monitor it on Windows.

Seagate says 50 C is max, others say 60 C is max. I assume you that even a failrly large case with normal ventilation (PSU) goes way above 50 C.

[jsnorman]

So I am now convinced that the problems I have been experiencing are purely heat soak. With the cover off, and making sure the southbridge has good airflow around/over it, I can run all day and night (3 days straight uptime in linux/gentoo 64 bit).

As soon as I put the cover back on today, wham 5 minutes later lag and then disk errors and network timeouts, then total death.

I keep going back to the quesiton - WHY NOW? The only change I had made before all this started was changing out the Opteron 240x2 for 246HE x 2. The 246HE put out half as much power and heat as the 240's so heat SHOULD be less of an issue than before. So why now when I ran for months at a time (with the cover on) on the 240s.

I think I have the answer.


It isn't what you hear, it is what you do NOT hear - e.g., the fans are off almost all the time now.

I think that the 246HE is so efficient, there is rarely any need for them to come on since the BIOS ties the fans to the CPU temp (or temp sensor 1 - I am not sure but temp sensor 1 seems to mirror the CPU temps pretty closely). In any event, the rarely, come on more than one or two throttles above minimum (2000rpms) and then go right back down when the cpus are cooled.

BUT, though the CPUs are cooled and temp sensor 1 (what is that tied to anyway?) is good, the heat inside the case is UNBELIEVABLY HOT. Hand burning hot when I touch the southbridge heatsink or hard drive cases for example. Even now, 30 minutes after my crash, the hard drives are so hot I cannot keep my fingers on them. No wonder the first drive got killed.

So in effect, because the CPUs are more efficient, the fans go on less, and ironically the other components get heat soaked - badly.

So am am thinking that (a) the zmaxdp is badly flawed for not having more temp sensors, and more ways of controlling fan throttling than just the one temp sensor, and (b) there are some serious airflow restrictions inside the case as someone else noted - another design flaw.

I am trying now putting the temp sensor/fan control on very low - I will experiment a bit but I am thinking 34 C shoudl keep the fans on more.

If that does not work, I am going to play with actively cooling the south bridge, or maybe a blowhole with an exahaust fan would be a good idea.

I am sure I cannot be the only one - do others with the 246HE notice any similar issues?